This is a machine-generated transcript. It was auto-transcribed from the council video, so names and wording contain errors (e.g. spelling of speakers' names) and should be checked against the official video before being quoted. The City's minutes are authoritative for who spoke. The timestamp links (▶) jump to roughly the right spot in the official video and may be off by a few seconds.
[00:07:17] ▶Speaker 0: Perfect. Okay. All good.
[00:07:19] ▶Alright. Thank you, everyone. Good evening. I will now call the public hearing of, Tuesday, 02/17/2026
[00:07:26] ▶to order.
[00:07:27] ▶This meeting is being, is being held in person by electronic means.
[00:07:32] ▶Council members and the public may participate by either method. Any council members joining electronically are reminded our channel to enable the video to confirm quorum.
[00:07:41] ▶The meeting is being livestreamed on the city's website and YouTube.
[00:07:45] ▶Meeting progress will be updated regularly on ex advanced city clerk.
[00:07:50] ▶In case of an emergency requiring evacuation,
[00:07:54] ▶there are two access located beyond the glass doors and to the left.
[00:07:57] ▶If the glass doors are blocked, please use, one of the four,
[00:08:02] ▶additional access within the console chamber.
[00:08:05] ▶Do not use elevators.
[00:08:07] ▶Use stairs instead.
[00:08:09] ▶If you need the mobility access assistance, remain where you are, and the security staff will get you to a safe location.
[00:08:16] ▶A defibrillator is available at the end of the hallway outside of this console chamber.
[00:08:21] ▶We acknowledge that we are on the unceded homelands of Musqueam, Squamish, and the Siletz Watus people.
[00:08:27] ▶We thank them for having care of this land and look forward to working with them in partnership
[00:08:32] ▶as we continue to build this great city together. And we also recognize the immense contributions of city of Vancouver's team members who work hard every day to help make our city an incredible place to live, work, and play. Clerk, may we have the roll call, please? Yes. Mayor Sim has a leave of absence for civic business all day. Councilor Curbillon?
[00:08:52] ▶Speaker 2: Present.
[00:08:53] ▶Speaker 0: Councilor Dominato?
[00:08:56] ▶Councilor Bly? Present.
[00:09:01] ▶Councilor Frey?
[00:09:05] ▶Present. Councilor Montague?
[00:09:07] ▶Speaker 5: Present. Councilor Klassen?
[00:09:09] ▶Speaker 0: Present. Councilor Meisner?
[00:09:11] ▶Present. Councilor Joe? Present. He's in the chair. Councilor Orr?
[00:09:16] ▶Councilor Maloney?
[00:09:18] ▶You have quorum, chair Joe. K. Thanks, clerk.
[00:09:20] ▶Before we begin, we have a few announcements. The public may speak in person or by phone and may submit written comments to mayor and council.
[00:09:30] ▶Speakers may only speak once and will have up to five minutes to comment on the merits of the application.
[00:09:37] ▶Please state whether that you are support or oppose the application
[00:09:41] ▶Speaker 4: and if you are Vancouver's
[00:09:43] ▶resident.
[00:09:44] ▶Speaker 0: Those representing four or more individuals or groups, including themselves,
[00:09:49] ▶may speak out for up to eight minutes. Each person being represented must confirm their name, presence in person or by phone, and may not speak separately.
[00:09:59] ▶Please follow the live stream or advance city clerk on x to track meeting progress
[00:10:06] ▶and know when your turn to speak in is is approaching.
[00:10:10] ▶Please know that the live stream has a slight delay.
[00:10:14] ▶Written comments can be submitted through the mayor and the council public hearing feedback
[00:10:18] ▶form on the city's website and linked on x.
[00:10:21] ▶If you are preregistered with a presentation,
[00:10:24] ▶see NEST
[00:10:25] ▶to have clerk advance your slides.
[00:10:28] ▶A reminder, at public hearing, council acts as a quasi judicial party
[00:10:33] ▶and must focus solely on the merits of the re
[00:10:37] ▶rezoning applications.
[00:10:38] ▶Members may ask clarifying question
[00:10:41] ▶of staff or speakers,
[00:10:43] ▶including the applicant, but should, reserve debate until after the speaker's list has closed.
[00:10:50] ▶After hearing from the speakers, counsel may, first, options, approve the application in principle.
[00:10:56] ▶Second, approve the application in principle with amendments.
[00:10:59] ▶Third, refuse application.
[00:11:01] ▶Or four,
[00:11:02] ▶refer the application to staff for further consideration.
[00:11:06] ▶Finally, if all items are not complete, the public hearing will recess and reconvene on Wednesday,
[00:11:12] ▶03/04/2026
[00:11:14] ▶at 3PM.
[00:11:16] ▶Alright. So the first item is city one rezoning,
[00:11:19] ▶4453
[00:11:21] ▶To 461
[00:11:22] ▶East 10th Avenue and 25,
[00:11:24] ▶36 To 2542
[00:11:27] ▶Guelph Street.
[00:11:29] ▶Before we begin this agenda item, if anyone believes they have a couple of interest, now is the time to declare it. Does anyone have a couple of interest to disclose?
[00:11:38] ▶Okay. So the clerk will now read the application and the summary of correspondence received.
[00:11:43] ▶Speaker 6: This is an application by Qualex Landmark Holdings to rezone 453461
[00:11:49] ▶East 10th Avenue
[00:11:51] ▶and 25362542
[00:11:53] ▶Gulf Street from R 52 District to CD 1 District to permit the development of an 18 story mixed use building
[00:12:02] ▶containing a 172
[00:12:03] ▶rental units with 20% of the residential floor area for below market rental units
[00:12:09] ▶and commercial space on the Ground Floor.
[00:12:12] ▶A floor space ratio of 6.24
[00:12:14] ▶and a height of 58 meters are proposed.
[00:12:17] ▶The general manager of planning, urban design, and sustainability
[00:12:21] ▶recommends approval
[00:12:22] ▶subject to conditions set out in the summary and recommendation.
[00:12:26] ▶The following correspondence has been received since referrals of public hearing.
[00:12:30] ▶26 pieces of correspondence and support and 10 pieces of correspondence and opposition.
[00:12:36] ▶This represents all correspondence received up to 5PM today.
[00:12:41] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you. This is the first call for speakers.
[00:12:44] ▶If you wish to speak with the council about this item, please call toll free +1 (833) 353-8610
[00:12:50] ▶followed by the participant code 1061445
[00:12:54] ▶before the close of the speaker's list.
[00:12:57] ▶The phone number will be posted on x and displayed during the recess.
[00:13:01] ▶There will be an opportunity for new speakers and the missed speakers to be heard at the end of the registered speakers list.
[00:13:08] ▶Okay. Now we have stuff on planning, urban design, and sustainability
[00:13:12] ▶here to present the application.
[00:13:14] ▶Please go ahead.
[00:13:16] ▶Speaker 4: Good evening, council. My name is Andrew Masiak, and I'm the rezoning planner for this application considered under the Broadway plan.
[00:13:23] ▶Council, please note this application before you is accompanied with yellow memo that notes that the site is eligible for the rental development relief program and amends the housing agreement to require 20% of the residential floor area be provided
[00:13:36] ▶at rates that do not exceed the citywide average rents.
[00:13:45] ▶The site shown in red is on the Northeast Corner Of 10th And Guelph in Mount Pleasant.
[00:13:51] ▶The site is comprised of four lots and the surrounding area is zoned r five two.
[00:13:57] ▶Speaker 0: They are currently developed with interrupt. We need to bring the slides to the the bigger screen.
[00:14:08] ▶Speaker 4: Yeah.
[00:14:34] ▶Speaker 7: Sure.
[00:15:07] ▶Speaker 4: Where do you want me to pick in from?
[00:15:13] ▶Speaker 0: It's not showing the full screen. Yeah.
[00:15:17] ▶Always a PDF.
[00:15:44] ▶Slideshow.
[00:16:24] ▶We need a recess. I think it's very easy to fix. Right? We don't need that.
[00:16:28] ▶Okay. Okay. Okay. So for the people waiting online, we are just dealing with a small minor technical issue here, so we'll be right right back, hopefully, within one minute.
[00:16:40] ▶Speaker 8: Yeah. That's right.
[00:17:00] ▶Speaker 9: No much cellular window.
[00:17:03] ▶Yeah.
[00:17:04] ▶Speaker 0: I selected the screen with our presentation.
[00:17:07] ▶Did you left? You wanna do this one? Did you pick this one? I did this one.
[00:17:12] ▶Speaker 10: Okay. Let's
[00:17:22] ▶Speaker 12: Perfect.
[00:17:24] ▶Speaker 0: Awesome. Okay. Please continue. Sorry about, the
[00:17:28] ▶challenge. Thanks.
[00:17:32] ▶Speaker 4: Yeah. So the site the site shown in red is on the Northeast Corner Of 10th And Guelph in Mount Pleasant.
[00:17:37] ▶The site is comprised of four lots in the surrounding area Zone R 52.
[00:17:42] ▶They're currently developed with four detached character houses. The houses were each constructed in 1910.
[00:17:48] ▶The properties are not listed on the Vancouver Heritage Register.
[00:17:51] ▶There are currently 14 rental units on-site. Eligible tenants are protected under the enhanced tenant relocation and protection policy.
[00:18:00] ▶The neighborhood is undergoing sig significant change with the future redevelopment as per the Broadway plan as well as the SkyTrain extension, which is scheduled to open in 2027.
[00:18:15] ▶This application is being considered under the Broadway plan. The site is located in the Mount Pleasant RT areas, area b sub area.
[00:18:23] ▶The plan permits 18 story market rental buildings with 20% of the residential
[00:18:28] ▶floor area secured as below market units.
[00:18:31] ▶The maximum density is 5.5
[00:18:33] ▶FSR.
[00:18:39] ▶Application was submitted 12/17/2024.
[00:18:43] ▶The applicant proposes a 18 story tower with rooftop amenities.
[00:18:47] ▶The project includes a 172
[00:18:49] ▶rental units, and 20% of the floor area are for below market units.
[00:18:54] ▶A density of 6.24
[00:18:56] ▶FSR and a height of a 190 feet are proposed.
[00:18:59] ▶The application proposes local serving retail as well as privately owned public space on the Southeast corner of the site.
[00:19:07] ▶This will provide new gathering space for residents and visitors in the area.
[00:19:16] ▶Virtual q and a period was held from June 18 to 07/01/2024,
[00:19:21] ▶and 74 pieces of feedback were received.
[00:19:25] ▶Support was expressed for the height and density,
[00:19:27] ▶variety of housing types, and transit oriented development.
[00:19:31] ▶Concerns were related to building height and fit,
[00:19:34] ▶affordability,
[00:19:36] ▶and displacement and infrastructure.
[00:19:39] ▶Staff have prepared the following in response to the concerns that were heard.
[00:19:45] ▶With respect to building height and fit, the application is consistent with the 18 story height for this area and the Broadway plan.
[00:19:52] ▶It also aligns with the former development envisioned under the plan.
[00:19:56] ▶With respect to affordability
[00:19:58] ▶and displacement, the applicant has provided a tenant relocation plan for eligible tenants which meet which meets the requirements of the city's TRPP
[00:20:06] ▶for the Broadway plan area.
[00:20:09] ▶Lastly, with respect to infrastructure,
[00:20:11] ▶staff expect an overall reduction in vehicle trips.
[00:20:15] ▶Additionally,
[00:20:15] ▶neighborhood residents will have increased mobility options with the opening of the Broadway subway.
[00:20:25] ▶The public benefits of this application consist of a 172
[00:20:29] ▶market rental units with 20% of the residential floor area for below market rental units.
[00:20:34] ▶The applicant also has requested a 100% waiver of on the citywide DCLs for the residential floor area.
[00:20:41] ▶This application will still be required to provide utility DCLs and a public art contribution.
[00:20:51] ▶In conclusion, this proposal aligns with the Broadway Plan and advances the City's rental housing targets.
[00:20:56] ▶Staff recommend approval of this application subject to the conditions outlined in Appendix B of the report.
[00:21:02] ▶Staff and the applicant team are available to answer your questions. Thank you. Thank you. Alright. Thanks for the presentation.
[00:21:08] ▶Speaker 0: Would the applicant like to present the application?
[00:21:11] ▶Yeah. Please go ahead.
[00:21:13] ▶Speaker 13: I think we have some slides that present, Okay. So I'm just picking up the slides.
[00:22:04] ▶Perfect.
[00:22:05] ▶Thank you very much for pulling those up. My name is Henry McQueen. I'm the executive vice president at Qualys Landmark. We're a local developer.
[00:22:12] ▶I've been building in Vancouver for over three decades.
[00:22:15] ▶We're actually starting construction on a on our first Broadway plant site at Kingsway and Fraser. It was approved at this council, just over a year ago and, advancing this one thanks to your, viability,
[00:22:26] ▶work that was done back in December.
[00:22:28] ▶I'm joined here by our president Cyrus Navabi,
[00:22:31] ▶Ben Renner, Lely Jalali, Raven Brown from Quallex, Peter Joyce, our transportation consultant from BUNT,
[00:22:37] ▶and Bruce Ramsey from Ramsey Wharton Architects.
[00:22:40] ▶I wanna thank staff, Andrew,
[00:22:42] ▶Dan, Yvonne, Emily, for for being so professional and and, great to work with very responsive working through this application.
[00:22:49] ▶I'm not gonna focus on the merits of this application,
[00:22:51] ▶tonight. I think those are outlined in staff's presentation. I wanna focus on, what's relevant for council, which is, just some of the things we heard from the community as we're advancing this project.
[00:23:01] ▶If you wouldn't mind, flipping through to the third slide, I would appreciate it.
[00:23:08] ▶And, the next one. Oh, sorry. The fourth.
[00:23:11] ▶The first one is around neighborhood trees. There's mature,
[00:23:14] ▶trees that are well regarded in this neighborhood. We wanna protect them. It's been a goal since we started this project. We've been working with a very qualified
[00:23:21] ▶arborist, and we worked with staff to actually increase the step back below grade, for the parkade from six feet to 12 feet.
[00:23:27] ▶But beyond that, there'll be a very strict tree protection zone,
[00:23:31] ▶guidelines during construction to ensure that the trees above grade canopy are protected during construction. Any work that happens in that zone, you typically have an arborist there to,
[00:23:40] ▶ensure that that work is happening according to their, protection plan.
[00:23:44] ▶The second piece, on the next slide, please, is
[00:23:50] ▶around, the the old homes that are on the site.
[00:23:53] ▶As, Planning mentioned, these are not, on the heritage register. We spent several months studying,
[00:23:59] ▶the the retention of any of them on the site, any of the four homes.
[00:24:03] ▶Guelph is extremely tight.
[00:24:06] ▶A house that would sit outside of the excavation would need to sit in the cities right away well beyond,
[00:24:10] ▶a typical parked car. Guelph, you have the hair the,
[00:24:15] ▶the the mature trees there and certainly overhead power lines and and trolley lines in the area that make it very challenging to to relocate a house if you wanted to save it and move it to another location.
[00:24:25] ▶This is not to say that it's impossible to keep a house here. This is to say that it's extremely,
[00:24:30] ▶expensive and and,
[00:24:32] ▶would cause a great degree of
[00:24:33] ▶construction, issues if we were to do so. Working with staff, we opted to keep the affordable housing levels in the site and not impact the site plan negatively by by taking up more open space on the outside in addition to a tower.
[00:24:46] ▶Next slide, please.
[00:24:48] ▶Managing construction has come up. You'll hear about it, I'm sure, during the, speaking point of this evening.
[00:24:54] ▶We've worked with our neighbors across the laneway. There's a really great, printing shop and, cafe directly across the laneway.
[00:25:01] ▶They're, of course, concerned about construction, long term, use of that laneway. We've already begun conversations with them. We'll work through a construction management plan, beginning now to ensure that they're,
[00:25:12] ▶not overly impacted by this. It's not to say that construction impacts will be entirely eradicated, but they can be mitigated,
[00:25:18] ▶through con
[00:25:19] ▶ongoing contact and conversation.
[00:25:21] ▶There was, of course, be on-site contact, that we can report and deal with issues immediately. We prefer not to be speaking through the city,
[00:25:29] ▶keeping the neighborhood clean, just basic principle, and and, of course, just advance notice if there's shutdowns, that sort of thing. Next slide, please. Tenant relocation, of course,
[00:25:37] ▶isn't this is our first time doing this in the Broadway plan and working with housing staff on those policies. So we've been working together,
[00:25:44] ▶closely with housing staff, for over a year now. We've met with the tenants. We've delivered eligibility letters. 10 of the 13,
[00:25:52] ▶homes there are, eligible under the TRPP.
[00:25:55] ▶And so we'll continue to work through that process with tenants and with our housing,
[00:26:00] ▶friends of the city.
[00:26:01] ▶Next slide, please.
[00:26:03] ▶Last way, laneway. Last thing is the laneway. Today, it's an 18 foot laneway. It'll be extended to 20 feet with a two foot dedication
[00:26:10] ▶on our side of the, property line. That'll extend it to 20 feet, meaning it's a standard lane way width. Because of the low parking ratio here, because of the proximity to transit, because of the proximity to the existing bike route, it's quite busy along East 10th. We expect a minimal impact to the laneway. We'll certainly speak to that more as we have a transportation consultant here.
[00:26:29] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you very much.
[00:26:30] ▶K. Thank you. Alright. So,
[00:26:33] ▶are there any question from council to staff or to the applicant?
[00:26:36] ▶Noting this is the only opportunity for council to ask questions,
[00:26:40] ▶of the applicant.
[00:26:41] ▶Counselor Orr.
[00:26:43] ▶Speaker 8: Yeah. Just, for staff. I noticed on your presentation
[00:26:47] ▶that it said, 20% below market rental on your presentation, but that's not the case. Right?
[00:26:53] ▶Speaker 4: I'd like our housing staff to jump in and answer this question, please.
[00:27:00] ▶Speaker 14: Hello. Ivan He,
[00:27:02] ▶senior housing planner.
[00:27:04] ▶Yeah. That's that's correct. The if council approves the the project,
[00:27:09] ▶along with the yellow memo, that would, secure the project under the rental development relief program.
[00:27:15] ▶The, below market rents would be
[00:27:18] ▶set at no higher than the citywide average rents, as published by CMHC.
[00:27:24] ▶Speaker 8: The memo was created on the tenth, but we didn't change the presentation. Is that right?
[00:27:33] ▶Speaker 14: Apologies.
[00:27:36] ▶Speaker 8: Yep. I'm sorry. We just didn't change the presentation. That seems a little misleading for people kinda following along online. When when was the memo posted to the website, the city of Vancouver
[00:27:49] ▶Speaker 14: website?
[00:27:50] ▶I will turn that back to,
[00:27:53] ▶to planning.
[00:28:01] ▶Speaker 15: Thank you for the question.
[00:28:03] ▶Don't have that handy, but we could pull that up really quick.
[00:28:06] ▶Speaker 8: It would have been within a day or two of the dates on the memo. Okay. There's a there's a blog post that says it was posted today.
[00:28:15] ▶I would have to check that. I don't believe that is correct. Don't believe that's correct. Okay. I'm just trying to get a sense, like,
[00:28:21] ▶in terms of,
[00:28:23] ▶sort of public feedback around,
[00:28:26] ▶20% BMR as being a sort of an acceptable con concession when weighed with sort of other things. I know there was concerns around the floor plate being bigger than the Broadway plan allows.
[00:28:36] ▶What would do you think that that there's a a sense that, you know, okay. Well, we'll I won't sign up to speak against the floor plate because at least there's 20% BMR. But now that that's not the case, can can you speak on that? That kind of
[00:28:52] ▶Speaker 4: thanks for the comment,
[00:28:53] ▶and question, counselor. It's 20% of the floor area, not 20% of the units.
[00:28:58] ▶Speaker 8: Yep. Sorry. I didn't oh, I didn't know I said 20% of the units. 20% of floor area.
[00:29:04] ▶Speaker 4: And housing, did you have anything else to add to this question, please?
[00:29:08] ▶Speaker 14: Just in terms of the process, because this was part of the,
[00:29:12] ▶development viability report that went in December 2025,
[00:29:16] ▶The the
[00:29:18] ▶the,
[00:29:20] ▶what council has approved allows
[00:29:23] ▶for
[00:29:24] ▶for,
[00:29:25] ▶eligible projects to fall under this program.
[00:29:31] ▶Speaker 8: I'm not sure that answers my question.
[00:29:33] ▶I was trying to get a sense of an acceptable concession when weighed with other factors that might be controversial, like the floor plate being
[00:29:42] ▶larger than the Broadway plan allows?
[00:29:45] ▶Speaker 14: Oh, sorry about that. Yes. There are there are two streams under the rental development relief program.
[00:29:51] ▶One is just about the affordability, and the second one also considers
[00:29:57] ▶minor increases in height and density.
[00:29:59] ▶So we
[00:30:00] ▶take that into consideration when we determine eligibility of the projects.
[00:30:05] ▶We have eliminated some projects because they don't meet the criteria we had set out,
[00:30:11] ▶prior to,
[00:30:13] ▶we had set out for council.
[00:30:14] ▶But this one does meet the the criteria.
[00:30:18] ▶Speaker 8: Maybe my maybe I'm not, asking the right question. I'm speaking around
[00:30:22] ▶sort of public feedback
[00:30:24] ▶in general in terms
[00:30:26] ▶of there being a concession that 20% below is seen as a as a good sort of concession
[00:30:32] ▶compared to,
[00:30:34] ▶never mind. I'll just move on.
[00:30:38] ▶Would these units,
[00:30:40] ▶or percentage of floor space, would that be considered under our housing targets for below market or not or not?
[00:30:47] ▶Just because I'm I'm just trying to get because I just kinda learned about this. I'm just trying to, like, figure it out where it's like
[00:30:52] ▶the report the the referral report still says, you know, percentage towards targets of
[00:30:58] ▶but that would no longer sort of apply here.
[00:31:01] ▶Speaker 4: Yvonne, would you be able to answer this question, please?
[00:31:05] ▶Speaker 14: I,
[00:31:06] ▶I would have to actually double check with,
[00:31:09] ▶policy staff to see if this if this falls under
[00:31:13] ▶our targets. I I believe it does, but I I can I can check and get back to you?
[00:31:19] ▶Speaker 8: Okay. Thanks.
[00:31:20] ▶And that's all my questions for now. Yeah. Thanks, councilor.
[00:31:24] ▶Speaker 1: Councilor Klassen? Yeah. Thanks very much.
[00:31:27] ▶So, interesting project. There's a,
[00:31:30] ▶obviously, a lot of attention being spent,
[00:31:33] ▶around
[00:31:34] ▶these,
[00:31:35] ▶Broadway plan projects.
[00:31:37] ▶And in this neighborhood, we've had a number of, projects that have come forward.
[00:31:42] ▶Had a chance to have a closer look at the,
[00:31:46] ▶the site and the adjacent properties.
[00:31:50] ▶So I my sort of questions really follow to how,
[00:31:55] ▶what kind of design strategies
[00:31:57] ▶And this might be a question,
[00:31:59] ▶for the applicant, but, staff can also weigh in what kind of design strategies
[00:32:04] ▶are being used to,
[00:32:06] ▶at the lower levels of the building to create a respectful transition to the residential properties that are adjacent,
[00:32:13] ▶particularly in terms of setbacks, landscaping, and unit orientation.
[00:32:17] ▶I know that, there's been a strong emphasis on the tree canopy on 10th Avenue,
[00:32:22] ▶but I'm just curious as to what thought was put into that.
[00:32:32] ▶Speaker 13: Thanks for the question, counselor.
[00:32:34] ▶Yeah. As you as you
[00:32:35] ▶spoke about the transition to the housing along East 10th is an important consideration.
[00:32:40] ▶There's a large setback off of East 10th,
[00:32:43] ▶following kind of the setback that exists today.
[00:32:45] ▶Another thing in our application we wanted to focus on is putting doors on East 10th in a real granularity to the to the texture and materiality along East 10th as well, sort of reflect that as well as sort of a break in that lower massing of the building before you transition to the tower piece. So
[00:32:59] ▶that's been the and, of course, a a significant landscape program as well in front of that.
[00:33:04] ▶Speaker 1: K. Thanks very much. And,
[00:33:07] ▶just wanna before you,
[00:33:09] ▶have a seat, I was just wondering
[00:33:11] ▶about,
[00:33:12] ▶the laneway activation, which is actually something that really impresses me.
[00:33:17] ▶I feel like that these spaces are often forgotten and and not utilized to their full extent.
[00:33:22] ▶As you point out, there's a pretty,
[00:33:25] ▶dynamic
[00:33:25] ▶business,
[00:33:26] ▶on the alley already, a print shop.
[00:33:29] ▶And so,
[00:33:30] ▶can you just sort of speak to,
[00:33:34] ▶you know, how this particular aspect of of the project will
[00:33:40] ▶be
[00:33:41] ▶a a a net public benefit rather than potentially
[00:33:44] ▶a a conflict point for other vehicles, service vehicles, waste collection, and all the rest of it that might,
[00:33:50] ▶Speaker 13: also be demanding use of that space. Thanks, councilor. Yeah. We're excited about it. I think it's
[00:33:57] ▶fabric and the building habitat, which is built across the laneway, is an example of a project sort of pioneering building new laneway retail.
[00:34:04] ▶We saw that opportunity to to match that and add to that vibrancy and draw people in off of Broadway into that laneway, by having retail on both sides. So
[00:34:12] ▶we we felt it important to sort of have an L shaped,
[00:34:15] ▶space where you could see it along Guelph, kind of breadcrumb pull you in off of Broadway as you're walking,
[00:34:21] ▶but also then have that, sort of vibrant laneway with eyes on the street in that laneway.
[00:34:25] ▶So I'm not aware of any other places where there's two new buildings with laneway retail facing each other. Thanks very much. And maybe I'll just kind of turn the question to staff.
[00:34:36] ▶Speaker 1: So, to to staff, I just wanted to I mean, again, sort of the same line of questioning.
[00:34:42] ▶This
[00:34:43] ▶project has its own sort of aspects to it. I'm just kind of curious what the reflection is from staff when they looked at in at at this project, how it,
[00:34:53] ▶how the additional density in this area can be paired with improved livability
[00:34:58] ▶and,
[00:34:59] ▶and,
[00:35:01] ▶create a sense of safety at the street level as well. I mean, these are important considerations when we're adding additional density to a neighborhood which has,
[00:35:10] ▶essentially detached housing right now.
[00:35:12] ▶Again, it's about trying to create a a welcoming connection to to a new space for this new housing.
[00:35:18] ▶Speaker 4: Thank you for that question, counselor.
[00:35:20] ▶That's something that we discussed really carefully throughout the process with the applicant.
[00:35:25] ▶And I'll ask our, development planner, Omar, to supplement that. Thanks very much.
[00:35:31] ▶Speaker 16: Omar,
[00:35:32] ▶development planner. Thanks for the question.
[00:35:35] ▶Yeah. So in terms of,
[00:35:37] ▶activating the space and within the neighborhood and having the project fit well within it, we look at things,
[00:35:43] ▶like,
[00:35:44] ▶the uses at at Grace. So we have the the commercial spaces, but also,
[00:35:50] ▶grade,
[00:35:51] ▶ground oriented units facing tenth,
[00:35:54] ▶and coupling that with things like there's a,
[00:35:57] ▶a pop space at the Southwest South East Corner. So this is more of a, you know, small gathering space for,
[00:36:04] ▶you know, folks within the neighborhood. There's a bench, and we work on we'll work with the applicant on, expanding that in terms of, size and functionality.
[00:36:15] ▶And,
[00:36:16] ▶there are other cosmetic,
[00:36:19] ▶sort of mechanism,
[00:36:20] ▶mechanisms that we we evaluate, like,
[00:36:23] ▶Speaker 1: softening the, the edges of the building. That's my time. So thanks very much. I appreciate it. Yeah. Thank you. Councilor Cabiel.
[00:36:31] ▶Speaker 9: Yeah. Thanks, chair. A couple of questions, and I'll direct one to the
[00:36:35] ▶well, it can be the applicant. Actually, I'll start with the applicant.
[00:36:38] ▶The POP to the publicly owned private space component, what are they,
[00:36:42] ▶what's the plan around that remaining open to the public?
[00:36:46] ▶Speaker 13: Thanks, councilor. We'd initially proposed two,
[00:36:49] ▶ops, one along East 10th along the bike route and one along Guelph.
[00:36:53] ▶Working with staff, they felt it would be better it'd be,
[00:36:55] ▶better as one larger pops.
[00:36:58] ▶So we'll work on that through the DP stage. It's currently contemplated that we'd maybe use a space in front of the retail along, Guelph against a space where you could probably you sorta see it from Broadway and kinda pull you in, off of Guelph and and just off the bike group. Okay. Let let me let me be, more explicit in the question. Is the intention that it's fully open to the public? It's not shut at certain hours? Yeah. That's right. It's, it's, privately owned space with a public easement over it. Not gated or anything. Okay. Great.
[00:37:24] ▶Speaker 9: And then following up on this might be a question to staff,
[00:37:28] ▶but I'm happy if the applicant wants to take it. I'm just looking for clarity. I'm sorry. This is repeating the earlier question
[00:37:33] ▶around the change to the BMR. It's still 20% of the floor area, but is the switch simply from the area comparison to the citywide
[00:37:41] ▶CMHC
[00:37:42] ▶average rents?
[00:37:43] ▶Speaker 17: Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity
[00:37:45] ▶to clarify.
[00:37:48] ▶The report and the presentation
[00:37:50] ▶correctly states that
[00:37:51] ▶the floor area is at a 20%,
[00:37:54] ▶below market rental.
[00:37:56] ▶So so,
[00:37:59] ▶that that's accurate. What the yellow moment clarifies is
[00:38:02] ▶based on the,
[00:38:03] ▶below market rental
[00:38:05] ▶relief program
[00:38:06] ▶that the depth of affordability
[00:38:08] ▶related to that 20 of floor area aligns with the citywide average
[00:38:13] ▶instead of 20% below the citywide average Okay. But still is considered below market rental.
[00:38:20] ▶Speaker 9: Right. And then following up on that, Josh, if I am I correct that depending upon
[00:38:24] ▶a number of, factors, like, if it's compared to an area rent, etcetera, that
[00:38:28] ▶when we were using area rents, the 20% could actually be a higher discount. It could have been 30 or 40% depending on the area and the specifics
[00:38:35] ▶Speaker 17: of a project. Is that Yeah. The benchmark we use is the citywide average,
[00:38:39] ▶and certainly some areas rent is higher.
[00:38:43] ▶One thing for sure is that,
[00:38:45] ▶the blow market rental units are still a substantial discount compared to brand new rental units.
[00:38:52] ▶Speaker 9: And they are they, they are at a covenant for the sixty years of life of the building Correct. As as per usual. Yeah. Okay.
[00:38:59] ▶Thanks. And then,
[00:39:00] ▶back to the applicant,
[00:39:02] ▶did that make any difference in terms of those,
[00:39:04] ▶recent changes by council with respects to the viability of this project? Yes. It did.
[00:39:10] ▶Speaker 13: If those viability measures hadn't been approved back in December, it would have been very challenging to move this project forward.
[00:39:16] ▶So, yes.
[00:39:17] ▶Speaker 9: Okay. Meaning that you might have just
[00:39:20] ▶Speaker 13: held up a longer timeline or what would We wouldn't come to public hearing if we didn't think there was a path forward.
[00:39:25] ▶So seeing those go through in December was,
[00:39:28] ▶very promising,
[00:39:29] ▶for this project.
[00:39:30] ▶And like I said, we're,
[00:39:32] ▶I think the second Broadway plan, project to begin construction. We intend to build this site. So,
[00:39:38] ▶Speaker 9: that's how we move forward with projects. Okay. So you are pretending to to
[00:39:43] ▶get underway and and get building?
[00:39:45] ▶Yes. Awesome. Thank you.
[00:39:47] ▶Speaker 0: Okay. Thanks, councilor.
[00:39:48] ▶Alright. Seeing no one else on the queue, this is the second call for speakers.
[00:39:53] ▶If you wish to speak with the council about this item, please call toll free. +1 (833) 353-8610
[00:39:59] ▶followed by the participant
[00:40:01] ▶code 1061445
[00:40:03] ▶pound before the close of the speaker's list.
[00:40:06] ▶The phone number will be posted on us and displayed during the recess.
[00:40:10] ▶We will now hear from the register
[00:40:13] ▶speaker for this item.
[00:40:15] ▶Any speaker in the council chamber, please come forward to the lab podium when it is your turn. Only speakers will be unmuted when it is your turn to speak.
[00:40:24] ▶Speakers will have to up to five minutes to make their comments and should limit their comments to the merits of the application
[00:40:31] ▶being considered.
[00:40:33] ▶Our first registered speaker is speaker number one Bobo Eric.
[00:40:37] ▶Online?
[00:40:47] ▶Bobo? Okay. Bobo, can you hear us?
[00:41:00] ▶Okay. Bobo, are you there online?
[00:41:07] ▶Hello, Bobo?
[00:41:10] ▶Speaker one numb Bobo, Eric, are you online?
[00:41:16] ▶Okay. We'll have to move on.
[00:41:18] ▶Okay. Speaker number two is, Jordan McDonald.
[00:41:29] ▶Speaker 18: Rick Living. Thank you very much for the opportunity to speak tonight.
[00:41:34] ▶I'm calling in just because I wanted to,
[00:41:37] ▶call in with my support for the project. I'm super excited about it.
[00:41:42] ▶As, as Henry mentioned, we developed the property across the lane
[00:41:47] ▶called Habitat. We completed that in 2023,
[00:41:50] ▶and we had purchased the land,
[00:41:52] ▶back in 2021.
[00:41:54] ▶And we always had this this vision of the lane being this, like, really,
[00:41:59] ▶really vibrant
[00:42:00] ▶area where we'd have businesses that kind of flooded out into the lane and almost kind of like a feeling like you
[00:42:06] ▶some of the lane ways that you see in Melbourne or other parts of the world.
[00:42:11] ▶I think that the back of these buildings
[00:42:13] ▶just have such an opportunity to have really cool businesses that,
[00:42:18] ▶that,
[00:42:19] ▶that really activate that space that is often just kind of a a forgotten loading area. So to see Qualex come in and and,
[00:42:27] ▶sort of take the torch and and, develop the other side of the lane and really create a vibrant space back there is is super exciting. So I support the project, and I'm really looking forward to seeing it come together. Thank you.
[00:42:40] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you. Alright. Speaker number three is Daniel Holloway.
[00:42:53] ▶Daniel, are you online?
[00:42:59] ▶Hi there. Can you hear me? Yes. We can. Please go ahead.
[00:43:03] ▶Speaker 18: Hi there. Thank you. I'm calling in to also voice my support for the project. I, live near City Hall, and I
[00:43:09] ▶use the 10th Avenue bike lane,
[00:43:12] ▶heading out towards Metrotown a lot.
[00:43:15] ▶So I'm quite familiar with the area and the project, and,
[00:43:19] ▶I think it's gonna fit in well
[00:43:22] ▶with Broadway plan. And I I really appreciate that they've, managed to keep that tree canopy because that's something I really value when I am
[00:43:30] ▶biking down West 10th.
[00:43:32] ▶And,
[00:43:32] ▶it looks and sounds like they are going to maintain a tenant tenant relocation plan, which is, important
[00:43:39] ▶for the city and
[00:43:41] ▶excited to hear about this new laneway project as well. So I do support it. Thank you. Thank you.
[00:43:47] ▶Speaker 0: Speaker number four is Lisa Rupert.
[00:43:58] ▶Online?
[00:44:00] ▶Speaker 20: Hello? Yeah. Hello? Yes, Lisa. I can hear you. You can hear me. Okay. Thanks. Good evening, members of council. My name is Lisa Rupert. I'm a longtime resident of East Vancouver, and I'm speaking in my capacity as the vice president of housing and violence prevention with the YWCA DC,
[00:44:15] ▶formerly the YWCA Metro Vancouver,
[00:44:18] ▶and I'm support in support of the Rezoning.
[00:44:21] ▶In my professional role, I've had the opportunity to partner with Quallex Landmark on two housing projects, and that experience is why I feel confident supporting this proposal.
[00:44:29] ▶They really listen to me,
[00:44:32] ▶as non profit housing providers and the needs of the remaining children who would be living in our new site.
[00:44:37] ▶Their collaborative process and the general care about the spaces they create really stood out for me, and I think that's so important in getting it right when new housing is being introduced into a neighborhood.
[00:44:47] ▶On this site, I would really see, for example, to see the plan retaining many of the trees that are such a part of the character of the area and will help the new building to fit in.
[00:44:57] ▶Vancouver's vacancy rates have been unhealthily low for many years. While there's been some modest improvement over the past year, adding more housing like this helps us move towards a healthier vacancy rate and a more stable rental market.
[00:45:09] ▶Finally, this location is just so well suited for more housing. It's got everything it can at least need, both to transit, grocery stores, Florence Nightingale Elementary,
[00:45:18] ▶and to amenities like Wells Park. And it's within walking distance to the popular shops and restaurants along Main Street, adding thoughtfully designed homes here along with ground level retail to put both the housing supply and the vitality of the neighborhood.
[00:45:32] ▶Thank you for this opportunity to speak, and I encourage council to support the Rezoning. Thank you.
[00:45:37] ▶Speaker 0: Alright. Thank you. Speaker number five is Mark Boardman.
[00:45:47] ▶Speaker 19: Mark?
[00:45:48] ▶Speaker 0: Hello, council. Can you hear me? Yes. We can. Please go ahead.
[00:45:53] ▶Speaker 21: Hello. My name is Mark Boardman. I'm the founder of Mini Village. We're a Vancouver based community building,
[00:45:59] ▶social purpose organizations. For the first for the past eight years, I've worked inside residential buildings across the city with people,
[00:46:07] ▶folks like YWCA, New Chelsea Society, Fabric, and others. And we help housing providers create the conditions where residents actually connect with their neighbors.
[00:46:17] ▶And I'm here tonight in support of the application because
[00:46:20] ▶I believe
[00:46:21] ▶it's really important to have a well designed
[00:46:24] ▶community,
[00:46:26] ▶facility. And I think this one is one of those.
[00:46:29] ▶Yeah. There are two crises in Vancouver. One is housing supply. The other one is loneliness.
[00:46:34] ▶And one in four Canadians report feeling lonely often. In our buildings, it's actually even higher than that. They don't have a single person they can call on for help.
[00:46:43] ▶And, the research is clear that loneliness has the same impact as smoking 15 cigarettes a day, and it has huge mental health, physical health, and other implications.
[00:46:54] ▶So I just want to talk about the reasons why I think this building works. It has commercial space, ground floor, retail.
[00:47:01] ▶It helps
[00:47:02] ▶make those casual everyday interactions
[00:47:05] ▶that are the foundations of neighborhood life. Those millions of micro
[00:47:09] ▶kind of interactions when people say hello to the barista or stop at a shop or walk past a space that feels
[00:47:15] ▶welcoming.
[00:47:17] ▶The other one is that, yeah, there is publicly accessible open space that's genuinely public, not gated.
[00:47:22] ▶It signals to people that you also belong here, and belonging is the foundation
[00:47:28] ▶of trust and also many other things.
[00:47:31] ▶The other one, it has really nice rooftop amenity space.
[00:47:36] ▶This is where community can gather, where people can watch a game, grow some herbs,
[00:47:40] ▶sit down with neighbors,
[00:47:42] ▶and,
[00:47:43] ▶yeah, this isn't really just a luxury kind of feature. It's really social infrastructure.
[00:47:47] ▶And we know that every dollar
[00:47:49] ▶multiplies,
[00:47:51] ▶in in terms of the outcomes for retention, turnover,
[00:47:55] ▶fewer complaints, and a stronger and more easygoing building culture.
[00:48:00] ▶20% below market rate's really important not just for affordability,
[00:48:04] ▶but it creates and helps to create the diverse intergenerational
[00:48:07] ▶communities that are genuinely
[00:48:09] ▶resilient so that people can look out for each other across differences of age, income, and backgrounds.
[00:48:15] ▶And that is the type of social fabric that we need more of.
[00:48:19] ▶The tree retentions and those laneways with the retail spaces
[00:48:23] ▶makes everything feel a little bit more connected and human,
[00:48:27] ▶a really important investment in neighborhoods well-being.
[00:48:30] ▶And so, yeah, that's that's really a long term relationship with the local community.
[00:48:35] ▶And just having that tenant protection commitments and, you know, not losing their labors, their routines, that sense of belonging, it's very hard to rebuild that. And so that that kind of policy matters a lot to me.
[00:48:47] ▶And, of course, like, Lisa just said, it's very transit oriented,
[00:48:51] ▶Broadway plan aligned, and really well scaled.
[00:48:55] ▶And, yeah. Just we want people to feel like they belong, and will this design
[00:48:59] ▶make it easier to do that. And what I seen of the plan and the design, it does it does just that. So I do support this application. Thank you so much for your time.
[00:49:09] ▶Speaker 0: K. Thank you. Speaker number six is Alexander
[00:49:13] ▶Silk.
[00:49:19] ▶Can you hear me? Yes. We can. Please go ahead.
[00:49:22] ▶Speaker 22: Hi. My name is Alex. Good evening, counsel. Thank you for the opportunity to speak tonight.
[00:49:27] ▶I'm calling as a medical student here at UBC,
[00:49:30] ▶and I'm calling in to voice my support.
[00:49:32] ▶I currently live in Mount Pleasant, and I think this project's gonna be great specifically for the future of health care workers.
[00:49:41] ▶I feel,
[00:49:42] ▶quite passionately about this, that part of the current doctor shortage that we're seeing in the Lower Mainland is,
[00:49:48] ▶secondary to the lack of,
[00:49:51] ▶housing that is
[00:49:52] ▶affordable for trainees.
[00:49:54] ▶And I think having this
[00:49:57] ▶20% of the floor plan being below
[00:50:00] ▶market,
[00:50:02] ▶having these rental options will help fill nearby hospitals,
[00:50:06] ▶mainly Vancouver General and BC Children's,
[00:50:09] ▶but also the primary care clinics.
[00:50:12] ▶And,
[00:50:14] ▶yeah, I'm I'm excited about this project. Thank you.
[00:50:17] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you. Speaker number seven is kindly regions.
[00:50:28] ▶Can everybody hear me? Yes. We can. Please go ahead.
[00:50:31] ▶Speaker 23: Okay. Wonderful. Hi. Good evening. My name is Kylie Riggins. I'm calling in tonight in support of this project.
[00:50:37] ▶I am a resident of Vancouver. I've been living in Mount Pleasant area for seven years,
[00:50:43] ▶with my husband and our golden retriever.
[00:50:45] ▶I moved up from The States. I became a Canadian citizen two years ago, so I'm very committed to this community and the development of this area.
[00:50:53] ▶When my husband and I first decided to make Vancouver our home,
[00:50:57] ▶we were really excited to move to such a beautiful city.
[00:51:00] ▶I was really excited to move to a place that had health healthy tech scene as I work in the tech industry.
[00:51:05] ▶However, we found it difficult to find good quality new rental housing in our desired locations,
[00:51:11] ▶Mount Pleasant being one of our top locations,
[00:51:14] ▶as it's near our work, transportation,
[00:51:16] ▶conveniently located to all of the amenities that we need.
[00:51:20] ▶So to me, adding more high quality rental housing in central neighborhoods like Mount Pleasant is essential to keeping professionals,
[00:51:28] ▶like myself and my husband, and families in the city supporting the local economy,
[00:51:33] ▶and just allowing for more dynamic and sustainable Vancouver. So I'm encouraged to see projects like this,
[00:51:38] ▶reflecting a balanced approach to growth. Thank you.
[00:51:43] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you.
[00:51:44] ▶Speaker number eight has withdrawn. Speaker number nine is Oliver Nicklin.
[00:51:54] ▶Oliver?
[00:51:59] ▶Can you hear me? Yes. We can. Please go ahead.
[00:52:02] ▶Speaker 26: Hey.
[00:52:03] ▶Yeah. Oliver Nixon,
[00:52:05] ▶Vancouver resident.
[00:52:07] ▶I'm the owner of AM Cafe with my partner, Lindsay, which is directly across the laneway from this proposed development.
[00:52:16] ▶And, yeah, I mean,
[00:52:20] ▶I'm torn on this, but,
[00:52:23] ▶we are in opposition to this development and primarily due to
[00:52:28] ▶the construction works that we're going to be forced to live through.
[00:52:32] ▶We opened our cafe
[00:52:34] ▶about eighteen months ago. Jordan, you heard from there, was the developer of our building. And
[00:52:40] ▶we put our life savings and a lot of love and care and attention into building
[00:52:45] ▶our cafe and the community that it serves,
[00:52:49] ▶over the last eighteen months.
[00:52:51] ▶And
[00:52:52] ▶that's likely
[00:52:54] ▶to be destroyed by
[00:52:56] ▶three years of construction works.
[00:52:59] ▶Our patio
[00:53:00] ▶and the summer season
[00:53:02] ▶and the summer season is when we make all our money,
[00:53:06] ▶And our ability to survive two or three summers of this construction works progressing,
[00:53:12] ▶will threaten
[00:53:13] ▶the livelihood of our business. And that's,
[00:53:16] ▶that's really sad for us to have to contemplate.
[00:53:20] ▶We are working with Henry and his team
[00:53:23] ▶on potentially
[00:53:24] ▶how we could mitigate
[00:53:26] ▶some of the impact of that to us. But, you know, I work in the construction industry,
[00:53:32] ▶alongside
[00:53:33] ▶our cafe.
[00:53:35] ▶And
[00:53:36] ▶it's I know what it's gonna be like. It's gonna be
[00:53:40] ▶horrific. Dust floating around, concrete trucks rolling around, and,
[00:53:45] ▶you know,
[00:53:47] ▶this city,
[00:53:49] ▶and a lot of people on this call have talked about building community. Well, community is built from establishments
[00:53:55] ▶like ours that serve them where people can come
[00:53:59] ▶and gather and,
[00:54:01] ▶spend time together.
[00:54:02] ▶And,
[00:54:03] ▶this development threatens that,
[00:54:06] ▶and the likelihood of us surviving. So, yeah, that's all I wanted to say on that tonight.
[00:54:11] ▶Thank you for your time.
[00:54:13] ▶Speaker 0: Okay. Thank you.
[00:54:15] ▶Okay. So we got some question from the audience. So anything we can do for you?
[00:54:41] ▶Okay.
[00:54:49] ▶Council.
[00:55:01] ▶Alright. So we're gonna continue with the next speakers.
[00:55:04] ▶Speaker number 10 is Alistair Clark.
[00:55:11] ▶Speaker 18: My name is Alistair Clark. I'm a resident of Vancouver, and I'm in support of the proposed rezoning and development.
[00:55:18] ▶First reason, I'm a renter in the area. And when I was looking for a home last year when I moved in there, I found a just a shortage of high quality professionally developed and managed buildings.
[00:55:28] ▶And I think developments like this expand the options for renters like myself from beyond kinda like basement suites and half of the house to something that, you could see yourself living in for a long term. And I think that'll trickle down to help control housing costs by increasing supply.
[00:55:44] ▶Second, like, the development just seems to make sense given the location of the future Mount Pleasant Subway Station and the major roadways knee nearby.
[00:55:52] ▶I I agree that, like, developments like this are not necessarily suitable for all neighborhoods, but this seems like a perfect location to be
[00:56:00] ▶building density and expanding options of housing for people in the city.
[00:56:04] ▶And then lastly, I've seen other developments from Quallex Landmark, and they seem thoughtful, well designed buildings that fit well with the surrounding neighborhoods.
[00:56:14] ▶And after looking at the plans and the renderings and listening to the proceedings tonight, especially things like the Lane Way commercial spaces, I'm confident that this is gonna be a great addition to the community and the type of buildings and developments that should be getting approved and built. Thank you very much.
[00:56:31] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you. So we have turned, up the volume a little bit, so I think everyone the chamber can hear very clearly right now. Because speaker number 11 is doctor Kevin Mowbray and doctor Evelyn Lowe.
[00:56:46] ▶Hi. It's Kevin. Can you hear me? Yes, Kevin. We can hear you. But as a procedure question,
[00:56:51] ▶can I ask you if you're at Reston of Vancouver?
[00:56:56] ▶Speaker 27: I'm not. I have doctor Lowe with me. She's gonna do the speaking. I own the we're the co owners of the optometry clinic in Habitat.
[00:57:04] ▶Speaker 0: Yep. That's okay. Just to proceed your question, please go ahead.
[00:57:08] ▶Speaker 27: Yeah. So I'll just introduce Evelyn. She's a far better speaker than, myself, but
[00:57:13] ▶we do support,
[00:57:14] ▶a rezoning for sure for all the reasons that have been mentioned. We like,
[00:57:18] ▶you know, a little higher density. We know people,
[00:57:21] ▶are having struggles with paying high rent. We believe in the low market rents.
[00:57:26] ▶And, I also like,
[00:57:28] ▶what I hear about the commercial on both sides of the laneway. I think that's kind of exciting and a first, and I'm excited to be part of that or a neighbor to that, and I've had a pleasure working with both Andrew from the city
[00:57:39] ▶and Henry from Quallex, who have been super cooperative and informative and, you know, helpful in answering questions. It is a scary time.
[00:57:47] ▶And, actually, before I pass it over to Evelyn, I'll just quickly say, I certainly feel for Ollie and Lindsay, the owners of AM Cafe and, you know, everyone that enjoys their time there. It is a scary thing, so I do hope,
[00:58:00] ▶some concessions can be made or or, you know, heavy cooperation with them to keep them going. I know I'll be,
[00:58:07] ▶still getting my morning coffees there regularly.
[00:58:10] ▶And,
[00:58:11] ▶finally, I'll say that we were gonna speak to a little bit about although we support it, we just hope it's done in a way
[00:58:17] ▶that takes into account that, you know, this is gonna be a first of its kind area with
[00:58:22] ▶commercial on both sides, foot traffic. I don't believe there's a sidewalk. We've got another tower going in soon. So for safety and and,
[00:58:30] ▶also
[00:58:31] ▶the timely access of our patients, Evelyn just wanted to speak a bit to that. So we do support, but we thought it would be a good opportunity to talk about, you know, some of these issues. So I'll hand it over to doctor Evelyn Lowe. Please go ahead.
[00:58:44] ▶Speaker 20: Can you hear me?
[00:58:46] ▶Speaker 0: Yeah. Please go ahead. Yep.
[00:58:48] ▶Speaker 28: Perfect. Just thank you for the opportunity to speak today. My name is doctor Evelyn Lowe, and, obviously,
[00:58:53] ▶in conjunction with my business partner, doctor Kevin Mowbray,
[00:58:57] ▶we're representing,
[00:58:58] ▶Mount Pleasant Optometry and the patients we serve regarding the proposed tower development and, of course, the potential use of the rear
[00:59:06] ▶rear alley as a construction access point.
[00:59:09] ▶Our clinic actually sees about a 125 patients every day.
[00:59:13] ▶If you don't know what an optometrist does, we basically not only check the eyes, but we do,
[00:59:18] ▶manage a lot of diseases out there for patients. So we are the primary eye care provider for patients similar to how your dentist would be.
[00:59:27] ▶And these patients, obviously, will rely on the,
[00:59:30] ▶alley to access our parking garage.
[00:59:32] ▶Many of these patients will be patients with mobility challenges who depend on the accessibility parking and the elevator access.
[00:59:39] ▶Any obstruction would directly impact their ability to attend the essential eye care appointment safely and on time.
[00:59:46] ▶We're actually one of the only and very few fully accessible optometry offices in the area.
[00:59:52] ▶I know that we are also a a legacy office, meaning that, we've been around for more than seventy five years. And so we do receive a lot of referrals from seniors. We have a lot of low vision patients. These are patients who really,
[01:00:04] ▶are visually impaired.
[01:00:06] ▶We have a lot of pediatric care. We have patients who are on the spectrum,
[01:00:11] ▶and we also have individuals who are recovering from traumatic brain injuries.
[01:00:16] ▶The different populations are very sensitive
[01:00:18] ▶to disruption.
[01:00:20] ▶Both, access barriers and loud construction noises will delay care.
[01:00:24] ▶It can also increase the distress and affect the recovery and the treatment progress.
[01:00:29] ▶So when there may be some small delays that compound quickly
[01:00:33] ▶and it can disrupt a whole day of patient care,
[01:00:37] ▶and various to timely access can shift the pressure onto emergency rooms and specialists
[01:00:42] ▶when these issues arise,
[01:00:44] ▶we do, and as Kevin has mentioned already, we do support the development,
[01:00:49] ▶of this
[01:00:51] ▶the building, of course, but, of course, in a way that is responsible.
[01:00:55] ▶So our request is really to simply say that construction planning needs to preserve the reliable patient access through the alley
[01:01:02] ▶and consider noise mitigation to to protect the vulnerable patients receiving care in our office.
[01:01:09] ▶Timely,
[01:01:10] ▶safe access to health care is actually essential for patients,
[01:01:14] ▶and it's essential for the broader health care system, and our community depends on that.
[01:01:19] ▶And that's all for me.
[01:01:21] ▶Speaker 0: Alright. Thank you. Yep. I think that's it. Yeah. Go ahead. We're done. I know it's user time. Okay. Thank you. Thank you for speaking to counsel.
[01:01:29] ▶Speaker number 12 is Michael Parker.
[01:01:39] ▶Can you hear me? Yes. We can. Please go ahead.
[01:01:42] ▶Speaker 29: Oh, great. I'm a resident of, Vancouver, also a small business owner of Sprezza Tour restaurant
[01:01:47] ▶at 11th And Kingsway
[01:01:49] ▶Speaker 19: to step up this, application.
[01:01:53] ▶Speaker 29: We've been in our space since, 2019.
[01:01:56] ▶We've gone through the pandemic and through a flood and also the change of, the local hotel into an SRO.
[01:02:02] ▶Speaker 27: When the SRO was installed,
[01:02:05] ▶Speaker 29: they took away the restaurant space,
[01:02:07] ▶that was beneath it. And so now we're the only sort of restaurant,
[01:02:12] ▶in our on the street, within a two block radius.
[01:02:16] ▶And I've had to adjust our opening hours,
[01:02:19] ▶due
[01:02:20] ▶to vandalism and just the lack of, pedestrians on the street. So any,
[01:02:24] ▶additional densification in the area is welcome.
[01:02:27] ▶I also think that this falls,
[01:02:29] ▶within the
[01:02:31] ▶parameters of the Broadway plan. And,
[01:02:34] ▶yeah, we're we're seriously,
[01:02:36] ▶looking forward to have
[01:02:38] ▶customers to patron the restaurant.
[01:02:41] ▶Speaker 0: K. Thank you.
[01:02:43] ▶Speaker number 13 is Max Birch.
[01:02:55] ▶Speaker 30: Hello? Can you hear me? Yes. We can. Please go ahead. Oh, hi. Hi. My name is Max Birch. I am the president of the Strata Council at 2520
[01:03:03] ▶Gell Street. So, again, the building just across the laneway.
[01:03:08] ▶Ollie and Lindsay are
[01:03:11] ▶our owners,
[01:03:13] ▶are renters in the building.
[01:03:14] ▶And Kevin and doctor Evelyn, obviously, from Pleasant Optometry, I'm here to support
[01:03:20] ▶both them and also
[01:03:22] ▶other residents in the building.
[01:03:24] ▶Unfortunately, again, like Ollie,
[01:03:27] ▶I'm torn in the the fact that this week, I have to oppose this in its present form simply because
[01:03:33] ▶we have no idea of of of an overriding,
[01:03:37] ▶an overarching logistical plan for the construction
[01:03:40] ▶or
[01:03:42] ▶for the heavy densification
[01:03:43] ▶of what are two very busy adjacent blocks on 10th Avenue.
[01:03:48] ▶It will be great to have more residents, and I think in ten years, it will be a huge plus in the area.
[01:03:55] ▶However, without,
[01:03:58] ▶a solid plan that addresses all four towers that are going up in the next five to seven years
[01:04:05] ▶on these two blocks, it's a very worrying time for everyone who lives and works in our building.
[01:04:11] ▶We we are working with Henry as are the other tenants and business owners in in the building. We're very happy to do so. It's important,
[01:04:18] ▶that we all get around the table for this and communicate.
[01:04:22] ▶But we are
[01:04:23] ▶worried that there's no
[01:04:25] ▶mandate from the city that that there has to be a traffic analysis
[01:04:29] ▶for,
[01:04:30] ▶this area. And considering if this building has a 172,
[01:04:33] ▶we've got to assume that there's something like
[01:04:37] ▶700
[01:04:38] ▶new
[01:04:39] ▶homes going in on these two blocks, and it seems a little shortsighted
[01:04:42] ▶not to have a more joined up
[01:04:45] ▶plan for the construction
[01:04:47] ▶and then
[01:04:48] ▶the supply of services to those new homes.
[01:04:52] ▶So, yeah, I'm grateful for you,
[01:04:55] ▶you know, the council giving me time to to air these concerns.
[01:05:01] ▶And, hopefully,
[01:05:02] ▶we can all come together to make this work.
[01:05:05] ▶Thank you very much for your attention and for your time today.
[01:05:09] ▶Speaker 0: Alright. Thank you. Speaker number 14 is doctor Oliver Nelson.
[01:05:22] ▶Hello? Can you hear me? Yes. We can. So doctor Nelson has a procedure question. I have to ask you if you're arrested in Vancouver.
[01:05:29] ▶Speaker 31: Yes.
[01:05:30] ▶Yes.
[01:05:31] ▶But thank you, counsel. Thank you, counsel, for taking my my call today.
[01:05:36] ▶So I am a new commercial.
[01:05:39] ▶I'm a I'm a family doctor for one. I'm a new commercial owner,
[01:05:43] ▶to one of the units at Habitat, and I will be having a family medical clinic that will be opening there in August 2026.
[01:05:52] ▶I'm actually
[01:05:54] ▶I'm I'm neither
[01:05:56] ▶supporting or opposing. I'm other.
[01:05:58] ▶One of my main things I I think I haven't really had time to connect with, Henry or Quallex at all during this time because I'm fairly new.
[01:06:05] ▶But,
[01:06:06] ▶one of my main concerns is that, as as with, Mount Optometry,
[01:06:12] ▶I'll have a significant amount of my a significant amount of my panel is,
[01:06:16] ▶has disabilities, has vulnerabilities.
[01:06:19] ▶I don't have any access, any sort of, any of this access to parking below. I only have parking for for for my my staff at the clinic. And so a lot of these people will be requiring,
[01:06:31] ▶on street access, basically, or curbside access to be able to access the clinic.
[01:06:35] ▶I know you know, with the with such a big
[01:06:38] ▶a big building going up and and I imagine a significant team there, one of my main concerns is that there's gonna be this is gonna significantly impact the the ability to access parking at curbside.
[01:06:50] ▶I have heard that there might be some plans going in there to to to assist with this, but,
[01:06:55] ▶I'm really hoping to avoid any any access issues for my patients in that time. I think the only other point I have is a point of security as well. I know that these these new
[01:07:06] ▶developments do have a lot of issues with security and as a family medical clinic there,
[01:07:11] ▶somewhere where we have medications
[01:07:13] ▶and these kind of things,
[01:07:14] ▶that
[01:07:15] ▶that doesn't
[01:07:17] ▶I'm hoping there's some kind of plan to avoid
[01:07:19] ▶these kind of, issues sort of coming over into Habitat as well. So, yeah, that's, I just hope if there's some clarification for that in the future.
[01:07:28] ▶Speaker 0: Okay. That's that's what I had. Thank you. K. Thank you, doctor. So you got one question from a
[01:07:35] ▶oh, okay. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Thanks, doctor Nelson.
[01:07:39] ▶Okay. Speaker 15 is, Ruth Cherry.
[01:07:46] ▶Yep. Yes. Go ahead.
[01:07:50] ▶Speaker 32: Good evening. Can you hear me? Yes. We can. Okay. Thank you. So my name is Ruth Cherry. I've lived in Vancouver since 1985.
[01:07:57] ▶I'm opposed to the rezoning application at 453
[01:08:00] ▶Dash 461
[01:08:02] ▶East 10th Avenue,
[01:08:04] ▶and 2536
[01:08:05] ▶To 2542
[01:08:07] ▶Guelph Street.
[01:08:08] ▶And so in the referral report of January twentieth this year, figure five,
[01:08:13] ▶low market unit average
[01:08:15] ▶rents, market rents in newer buildings,
[01:08:18] ▶and cost of ownership
[01:08:20] ▶ownership, excuse me, and household incomes.
[01:08:23] ▶The square footage deemed acceptable for studios to three story or excuse me, three bedroom apartments,
[01:08:29] ▶And so rental cost therein
[01:08:32] ▶is quite extraordinary.
[01:08:34] ▶It's very small.
[01:08:36] ▶The square footage is quite small, and the rents
[01:08:40] ▶are pretty unaffordable.
[01:08:42] ▶So in appendix b, conditions for approval, section 1.1, subsection c,
[01:08:48] ▶is noted to
[01:08:50] ▶evolve the building expression as a reflection of the neighborhood's
[01:08:54] ▶architectural history and emerging character.
[01:08:57] ▶And there's a note to the applicant,
[01:08:59] ▶the architectural
[01:09:00] ▶components should recognize the importance of Central Broadway as Vancouver's second downtown
[01:09:06] ▶and contribute to the area's human experience and livability.
[01:09:10] ▶Mount Pleasant is an eclectic and diverse neighborhood
[01:09:13] ▶with a mix of industrial land, cherished local shops, and services,
[01:09:18] ▶and a strong arts and culture presence.
[01:09:21] ▶The architecture of high rise residential buildings should provide
[01:09:25] ▶attractive near views and reflect the primarily excuse me. Primarily as residential character
[01:09:31] ▶of their surroundings.
[01:09:34] ▶So at present, on this proposed rezoning site, there are four character buildings that are over a 100 years old.
[01:09:41] ▶They're slated to be destroyed for this 18 story high rise,
[01:09:45] ▶and it does not take into the above into consideration at all,
[01:09:50] ▶which unfortunately is not atypical of the proposed buildings put before council thus far for CD dash one rezoning.
[01:09:58] ▶In a last minute yellow memo from Josh White,
[01:10:03] ▶02/10/2026,
[01:10:05] ▶it would the memo would remove 20%
[01:10:08] ▶the 20 requirement for below market rental units at a rezoning proposal.
[01:10:15] ▶Now this, I believe, was addressed earlier this evening.
[01:10:19] ▶And this was added to the public hearing agenda for today.
[01:10:24] ▶The excuse me. I'm just skipping over things due to time.
[01:10:29] ▶So it's basically a bailout,
[01:10:32] ▶this rental development relief program.
[01:10:35] ▶It was passed 12/10/2025.
[01:10:39] ▶And
[01:10:40] ▶right, White writes, under the rental development relief program for which this project is eligible, the housing agreement will be amended
[01:10:48] ▶to acquire 20% of the residential floor area to be divided at rates that do not exceed
[01:10:55] ▶the CMHC
[01:10:58] ▶citywide average rents,
[01:11:00] ▶contingent upon the applicant obtaining a stage one building permit within twenty four months of council approval of this rezoning.
[01:11:08] ▶So in other words, 20% of the unit area that was supposed to be offered at 20%
[01:11:13] ▶below market rents
[01:11:15] ▶would become simply the average market rent
[01:11:19] ▶for that 20%.
[01:11:20] ▶And for the other 80% of the rental floor area, there's no upper
[01:11:26] ▶limit for rents.
[01:11:28] ▶So it's not nearly as attractive. You know, people are being told that this is affordable. There's 20% affordable,
[01:11:35] ▶even more affordable housing. It really isn't, and it's a bit of a whitewash.
[01:11:40] ▶There appears to be a free for all to allow development in any place that developers choose.
[01:11:46] ▶We're not. The city is not directing. It's developers that are.
[01:11:50] ▶And I've only heard of one application being refused.
[01:11:54] ▶And I'm wondering why there is this mad rush
[01:11:57] ▶with seemingly little long term consideration
[01:12:01] ▶to the permanent restructuring of the city, a claim for its livability,
[01:12:05] ▶And who knows how long that latter point will be valid?
[01:12:09] ▶Thank you, mayor.
[01:12:10] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you.
[01:12:12] ▶Yes. Speaker
[01:12:13] ▶Speaker 33: Sorry, mayor.
[01:12:15] ▶Speaker 34: You can out of here after you you. I just wanted to make one point. I watched her hands trembling as she gave that statement.
[01:12:24] ▶I don't appreciate as a preschool teacher that cares about these matters as we elect you to care about them.
[01:12:30] ▶Speaker 0: I've watched those two talk to each other. Sorry. Please be quiet. So I think this is the council chamber. We have to continue our regular business. People on their phones.
[01:12:39] ▶Speaker 34: Can we all take this seriously, you guys?
[01:12:42] ▶I'm a teacher.
[01:12:46] ▶Speaker 0: K. So we have to take a quick recess to solve this issue. We'll have to be we'll have to be
[01:12:56] ▶Let's come back in probably
[01:12:59] ▶five minutes.
[01:13:00] ▶Yeah. Sure.
[01:16:06] ▶Speaker 3: Yeah. Okay.
[01:16:08] ▶Speaker 0: Alright. So we're gonna keep on going. So next one is, number 16, Luis
[01:16:16] ▶Vegas.
[01:16:17] ▶Luis? Yeah. She she he's coming.
[01:16:30] ▶Yeah. Let's load Luis' presentation.
[01:16:55] ▶Oh, so, Luis, you did not send
[01:16:59] ▶okay. So you did did not send the presentation yesterday by 5PM?
[01:17:02] ▶Speaker 10: Yeah. I sent it by 04:30.
[01:17:05] ▶Speaker 0: Okay.
[01:17:06] ▶Speaker 10: Actually, this one, I sent in by 11:00 in the morning. Yesterday? Yep. Okay. So we should have your presentation then.
[01:17:13] ▶Speaker 0: K. Let's double check.
[01:17:36] ▶Speaker 10: Send it again and speak later.
[01:17:48] ▶Speaker 0: Okay. Did you send your slides to the speaker's inbox or the correspondence?
[01:17:53] ▶Speaker 10: I just,
[01:17:54] ▶attached it to the,
[01:17:56] ▶speaker's
[01:17:57] ▶request
[01:17:58] ▶email information that I
[01:18:00] ▶Speaker 0: Okay. So we can double check
[01:18:02] ▶how to locate your presentation.
[01:18:12] ▶Do we need to take a recess or
[01:18:14] ▶okay. We're gonna take two minutes recess so we can find your presentation.
[01:19:54] ▶Absolutely did not receive your presentation
[01:19:56] ▶before 5PM yesterday.
[01:19:59] ▶We received we didn't receive at all.
[01:20:12] ▶Okay. So
[01:20:16] ▶this
[01:20:22] ▶And you need your presentation for the
[01:20:25] ▶for speaking to counsel. Right?
[01:20:30] ▶What?
[01:20:31] ▶Okay.
[01:20:41] ▶Is it there?
[01:20:50] ▶Search. Search.
[01:20:59] ▶Alright. So we just triple checked in our system. We did not receive your presentation
[01:21:04] ▶at all.
[01:21:06] ▶So can you just do the, speaking without the presentation?
[01:21:17] ▶Sorry. It's already past 5PM.
[01:21:19] ▶That deadline is 5PM yesterday. We have to be fair with everyone.
[01:21:23] ▶K.
[01:21:27] ▶K. Thank you.
[01:21:30] ▶Okay. Speaker number 17 is Jennifer
[01:21:32] ▶Vooras.
[01:21:42] ▶Speaker 13: Jennifer?
[01:21:44] ▶Speaker 0: Yeah. Hello. I'm here. Okay. Please go ahead, Jennifer.
[01:21:48] ▶Speaker 28: Is my presentation there?
[01:21:51] ▶Speaker 0: Did we receive Jennifer's presentation?
[01:22:13] ▶I'm watching on the live stream, and I don't I don't keep picking up, but that's that's okay. I can speak without it. Yeah. Jennifer, we are just trying to locate your presentation. Did we receive your Okay. Okay. We do have your presentation. Please go ahead with your speech.
[01:22:26] ▶Speaker 28: K.
[01:22:27] ▶Perfect.
[01:22:28] ▶Okay.
[01:22:29] ▶And let me begin. My name is Jennifer Volras. I am not only just a resident of Vancouver.
[01:22:34] ▶I'm actually a resident of this block, and I live on the lane,
[01:22:39] ▶that this will be impacted or built.
[01:22:41] ▶So I would like to begin by saying I love Vancouver,
[01:22:44] ▶and I love my neighborhood.
[01:22:46] ▶Council, I support housing
[01:22:48] ▶and transit oriented growth,
[01:22:50] ▶but I oppose
[01:22:52] ▶this application
[01:22:55] ▶for the following reasons. Density
[01:22:58] ▶belongs on major arteries.
[01:23:00] ▶It works when it's strategically placed along arteries that are designed to carry it. Think of Canby Street,
[01:23:06] ▶Davie Street,
[01:23:08] ▶10th Avenue or 10th yeah. 10th Avenue now has four applications
[01:23:13] ▶for 16 story buildings or greater.
[01:23:16] ▶This site does not share the same corridor or service readiness that those other Kambi And Davie Streets have.
[01:23:23] ▶Second of all, our infrastructure is already
[01:23:27] ▶overextended.
[01:23:28] ▶Health care capacity is already stretched in Vancouver.
[01:23:32] ▶Emergency departments operate at or near capacity,
[01:23:35] ▶adding population density
[01:23:37] ▶without parallel health care expansion
[01:23:40] ▶intensifies the strain on the system.
[01:23:43] ▶Schools are full, day care is scarce, and our underground systems of hard infrastructure like sewers and water systems,
[01:23:51] ▶storm management
[01:23:52] ▶limits already
[01:23:53] ▶are aged and out and need improvement.
[01:23:57] ▶So density
[01:23:58] ▶without first upgrade
[01:24:00] ▶compounds the problems we already have.
[01:24:03] ▶Next, market reliability
[01:24:05] ▶and reality.
[01:24:07] ▶If you take a look, and it's too bad my you can't see my slides,
[01:24:11] ▶walk this area. It's a gorgeous area. However, within one block, there's the Saint George,
[01:24:17] ▶which is just built. And when you walk that street, it's on Broadway, like I said, half a block away, there's two words you're gonna notice that entire ground level. It says for sale.
[01:24:29] ▶None of the commercial space has been rented or sold,
[01:24:33] ▶meaning we haven't already absorbed
[01:24:36] ▶what has been approved.
[01:24:38] ▶So do not
[01:24:40] ▶allocate more when we can't even
[01:24:43] ▶have
[01:24:44] ▶the tenants that want what's there now. Plus, you talk about affordability.
[01:24:48] ▶20%. I've tried to understand what that means.
[01:24:51] ▶What what it also means, 80%
[01:24:54] ▶is not below market value. When you look at the price of housing
[01:24:58] ▶for this area,
[01:24:59] ▶you're looking between
[01:25:01] ▶over $1,100
[01:25:02] ▶per square foot up to $1,500
[01:25:05] ▶per square foot.
[01:25:06] ▶And these places are tiny. They're 536
[01:25:10] ▶square feet. So I'm not sure again how mental health will do when you live in a tiny
[01:25:15] ▶place and when it comes to getting out and having a healthy lifestyle. So I'm talking about
[01:25:20] ▶affordability
[01:25:21] ▶and livability.
[01:25:23] ▶And then also the environmental and structural considerations.
[01:25:27] ▶When you have a high rise structure, this increases the subsurface pressure and hydrostatic
[01:25:33] ▶impact.
[01:25:34] ▶Mother Nature will always win. Again, when you walk this site, you'll see how close it is to the St. George Rainway,
[01:25:42] ▶system.
[01:25:43] ▶And, again, you're adding more and more constraints on this area that I do question. There's literally a river that runs through this area. And building these high rises
[01:25:53] ▶within such a close proximity. Does that really make sense?
[01:25:57] ▶And I have to add that I have a little parking stall that measures 10 feet by 15 feet, and the city will not let me pave that. But it's okay to build these massive
[01:26:07] ▶high rise buildings.
[01:26:09] ▶So in conclusion, council,
[01:26:11] ▶this is not opposing housing.
[01:26:13] ▶It's about sequencing growth responsibly.
[01:26:16] ▶When schools are full, hospitals are strained,
[01:26:19] ▶daycare space is scarce,
[01:26:21] ▶and our underground systems are aging. Approving expansion is not smart planning. It is simply deferred liability.
[01:26:28] ▶So I ask you to pause, pump the brakes on this, and you're in a very powerful position. Love the city. Let's get this right and not just
[01:26:36] ▶Speaker 0: drive it through. Thank you. Thank you, Jennifer. I just wanna let you know that our clerk told us your presentation was circulated,
[01:26:44] ▶after 5PM yesterday.
[01:26:47] ▶It was received late, so that's why we were not able to display your presentation.
[01:26:51] ▶Okay. Speaker Thank you. That's fine. Thank you so much for speaking to counsel.
[01:26:55] ▶Okay. Speaker 18 is Emily,
[01:26:58] ▶board Wardlow.
[01:27:00] ▶Yes. Can you hear me okay? Yes. We can. Please go ahead.
[01:27:04] ▶Speaker 28: Perfect. Thank you. Good evening, everybody. My name is Emily Bordlow. I'm a resident of Mount Pleasant
[01:27:09] ▶and the Strata Council member for 2520
[01:27:12] ▶Guelph Street. I'm speaking tonight on behalf of the council and residents of this building.
[01:27:17] ▶I am speaking in opposition to this rezoning application,
[01:27:20] ▶not because I oppose housing
[01:27:22] ▶and not because I oppose density,
[01:27:24] ▶but because I am concerned about the lack of integrated planning accompanying the scale of development proposed.
[01:27:30] ▶This application proposes four eighteen storey towers across two adjacent blocks in an area that is already operating at a capacity
[01:27:38] ▶in terms of public space, traffic flow, and community services.
[01:27:42] ▶My first concern is the absence of a clearly articulated construction logistics plan.
[01:27:48] ▶Raising four high towers
[01:27:50] ▶on two adjacent blocks requires years of staging, heavy equipment, truck movement, lane closures, material storage.
[01:27:57] ▶The public realm in this area is already constrained.
[01:27:59] ▶There has been no transparent explanation of how construction access will be managed without overwhelming the 10th Avenue Greenway,
[01:28:07] ▶adjacent residential streets, or the narrow lane way between Broadway and 10th.
[01:28:11] ▶We are being asked to accept years of disruption without a clear mitigation strategy.
[01:28:17] ▶Secondly, there appears to be no meaningful analysis of traffic impacts.
[01:28:21] ▶Nearly 800 new homes across two blocks will significantly alter traffic patterns, both during construction and once occupied.
[01:28:28] ▶10th Avenue is designed is or is designated, sorry, a bike route and an East West corridor that is key to the community.
[01:28:36] ▶The alley between Broadway and 10th is already tight and heavily used, yet there has been no comprehensive modeling shared with residents showing projected vehicle movements, loading access, rideshare use or emergency vehicle flow.
[01:28:49] ▶As already stated by others in opposition
[01:28:52] ▶to this rezoning application, have noted that density without transportation planning creates conflict, not community.
[01:28:59] ▶Thirdly,
[01:29:00] ▶there has been insufficient communication regarding forward planning for essential neighborhood services.
[01:29:06] ▶An increase of this magnitude will place pressure on daycare availability,
[01:29:09] ▶elementary school capacity, green space, rec facilities and other community infrastructure.
[01:29:15] ▶We have not seen a coordinated plan addressing how these services will scale alongside the housing increase.
[01:29:21] ▶Housing cannot be treated in isolation from the systems that support the family and residents.
[01:29:27] ▶In addition, I would also like to note that I am here speaking on behalf of those who have signed the community petition that was forwarded to city council,
[01:29:35] ▶circulated regarding this proposal,
[01:29:37] ▶for which there are currently
[01:29:39] ▶three
[01:29:39] ▶twenty five signatures
[01:29:41] ▶and growing in opposition to this application.
[01:29:45] ▶This petition reflects the concerns of numerous residents in the immediate area and many of whom share the same questions I have raised tonight
[01:29:52] ▶and more,
[01:29:53] ▶particularly around the construction logistics,
[01:29:56] ▶traffic impacts, and the absence of coordinated service planning.
[01:30:00] ▶The volume of feedback demonstrates that these concerns are not isolated or anecdotal,
[01:30:05] ▶but are widely felt within the neighborhood.
[01:30:07] ▶The petition demonstrates that residents are not opposing growth itself,
[01:30:11] ▶but as stated, asking for thoughtful,
[01:30:13] ▶coordinated planning that matches the scale of what is being proposed.
[01:30:17] ▶Something in particular I wanna highlight that concerns the laneway north of the site itself and something Kelseyman Klassen brought up earlier.
[01:30:24] ▶The reef learning application relies on that narrow lane way for parkade and loading access.
[01:30:29] ▶Yet the same application describes the north side as unlikely to be redeveloped,
[01:30:34] ▶and this contradiction matters.
[01:30:36] ▶The lane currently only supports a single car width and is regularly blocked by routine city services, and increasing heavy
[01:30:43] ▶vehicle use there during and after construction will have direct consequences
[01:30:48] ▶for residents and local businesses.
[01:30:50] ▶It is important to note that it is one of the key measurements
[01:30:53] ▶in the application that was not articulated clearly
[01:30:57] ▶as to how much it will be widened.
[01:31:00] ▶It's important
[01:31:02] ▶given that the proposal includes limited public accessible open space,
[01:31:07] ▶Privately owned public spaces that are partially restricted or resident focused are not a substitute for true public green space
[01:31:15] ▶that serves the broader neighborhood.
[01:31:18] ▶The final three points are that development must be thoughtful and sequential.
[01:31:22] ▶Infrastructure planning should proceed or at least accompanying major upzoning.
[01:31:26] ▶Without that, we risk eroding livability and undermining public trust. I respectfully ask Council to pause its rezoning
[01:31:33] ▶until comprehensive logistics,
[01:31:35] ▶transport analysis, and service planning are transparently presented and evaluated.
[01:31:40] ▶We deserve development that is not only tall, but well planned. And I'd like to acknowledge speaker 15. I really appreciate
[01:31:47] ▶their,
[01:31:48] ▶courage to speak in person there today and ask that all in attendance in person continue to remain,
[01:31:55] ▶vigilant in listening to all the concerns, whether it is in support or opposition raised here today.
[01:32:01] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you, Emily. Thank you. That's your time. Thank you so much. Alright. So, if there are additional speakers in the council chamber, please come forward to the podium.
[01:32:11] ▶Okay. So, Clark, are there any additional speakers on the line?
[01:32:30] ▶Just checking, Cher. Yep. We were just missing speaker number one if he's online.
[01:32:35] ▶Speaker 1: Speaker one is not online. We have one unknown number. Last four digits, 3337.
[01:32:44] ▶Speaker 19: Hello?
[01:32:45] ▶Speaker 0: Yes.
[01:32:46] ▶Speaker 36: Hi. Sorry. My name's, Matthew Cruickshank.
[01:32:51] ▶First off, I I'm a resident of Vancouver, and thank you, counsel, for taking my call
[01:32:56] ▶today.
[01:32:57] ▶Speaker 37: I just wanted to say just, you know, give my 2¢ on this.
[01:33:02] ▶Speaker 36: So I work in trades, and I am trying to keep it short and sweet, but I'm in support of this,
[01:33:09] ▶future rental housing
[01:33:13] ▶Speaker 27: project.
[01:33:14] ▶I think, you know, it's it's
[01:33:16] ▶good, especially for,
[01:33:18] ▶Speaker 36: you know, the construction industry.
[01:33:21] ▶And
[01:33:22] ▶yeah.
[01:33:23] ▶And it's it's close to transit as well too. So
[01:33:26] ▶Speaker 0: thank you. Yes. Thank you. Alright. Are there any other speaker in the council chamber or on the line?
[01:33:36] ▶There are not. Okay. Thanks. So this is the third and the final call for speakers. If you wish to speak to counsel about this item, please call toll free +1 (833)
[01:33:46] ▶353-8610
[01:33:47] ▶followed by the participant code 1061445Pound
[01:33:51] ▶before the close of the speaker's list.
[01:33:54] ▶The phone number will be posted on our x and displayed during the recess. We will not take two minutes recess for any additional speakers to call in or come forward to the podium.
[01:34:03] ▶Gonna be back at 07:36.
[01:36:08] ▶Okay. Need one more. Councilor Clausen.
[01:36:27] ▶Sean's coming. Yeah. There we go. We have Cormac. Perfect. Thank you. Alright. So, I think, we have one more speaker on the line. Speaker number one, Bobo Eric.
[01:36:38] ▶That's me. Yeah. Let me just go ahead.
[01:36:42] ▶Speaker 37: Perfect. Thank you. Yeah. I don't wanna take up too much time.
[01:36:46] ▶But, Yeah. My name is Bobo Eirek. I'm a resident of Vancouver. I'm actually resident of Mount Pleasant. I live on 10th just on the other side of Fraser from
[01:36:54] ▶this project and the other,
[01:36:56] ▶ones that have come up,
[01:36:58] ▶And I'm speaking in support of this project.
[01:37:02] ▶We Vancouver needs more housing.
[01:37:05] ▶We've made some improvements in
[01:37:08] ▶in rents that rents have come down largely due to sort of demand side changes that have come from the federal government, but we're now we're now stalled.
[01:37:16] ▶And if we want rents to continue to get lower, we're gonna need more housing
[01:37:21] ▶and so this project really
[01:37:23] ▶fits the bill for that.
[01:37:27] ▶On another
[01:37:28] ▶note,
[01:37:30] ▶it's just another sort of moment of frustration for me that we passed the Broadway plan years ago, and yet we're still sitting through the rezonings because,
[01:37:38] ▶the city led rezoning
[01:37:40] ▶doesn't
[01:37:41] ▶actually rezone everything. So I wish we didn't have to do this, but here we are.
[01:37:46] ▶And,
[01:37:47] ▶for, I mean, for for this project and for other projects in general, I, I wanted to sort of flag a concern that I have about the,
[01:37:57] ▶the tenant or the Broadway plan tenant protections.
[01:38:01] ▶When I read
[01:38:02] ▶the report the city's reports as to how these are supposed to go, and
[01:38:06] ▶the city seems to be
[01:38:08] ▶seems to require that developers or the owner of the building,
[01:38:14] ▶do the income verification for,
[01:38:17] ▶for the below market or, you know, in this case I mean, it's still below market, but the the citywide average,
[01:38:22] ▶homes
[01:38:23] ▶that are included.
[01:38:25] ▶And then
[01:38:26] ▶these have to be income tested or the residents of those homes have to be income tested every five years.
[01:38:32] ▶And if they fail to or if they earn too much money that they are then going to be evicted from their homes to make space for
[01:38:40] ▶new residents.
[01:38:42] ▶My understanding is I don't see how this is legal.
[01:38:46] ▶There are policies in place by the provincial government to allow,
[01:38:51] ▶sort of income verification for subsidized units, but that's only for non profit housing providers or associates of the municipal government.
[01:38:58] ▶And the city has made it very clear that they're not running these below market
[01:39:04] ▶homes and the and the the application for that.
[01:39:07] ▶So,
[01:39:09] ▶if this is a private developer that is
[01:39:12] ▶or a private owner that is running
[01:39:15] ▶the building and doing the income verification, it's not clear to me that they have the authority under the Residential Tennessee Act to actually evict these to evict people.
[01:39:24] ▶Not that I think evicting people from
[01:39:27] ▶those homes is good,
[01:39:29] ▶but this just seems to me as a concern that I hope council is thinking about.
[01:39:35] ▶And the second thing I want to sort of make a point about this again is a general complaint,
[01:39:40] ▶but
[01:39:40] ▶these are
[01:39:41] ▶we're doing means testing for these below market
[01:39:44] ▶rent housing
[01:39:47] ▶and then sort of provide and they and they become sort of winners.
[01:39:51] ▶But
[01:39:52] ▶if the if the eviction if if indeed the the goal is to evict people when they make too much money, all of a sudden you've created an incentive where people don't want to actually earn more because they might come
[01:40:02] ▶out behind
[01:40:04] ▶because they would the difference between what they pay currently for housing
[01:40:09] ▶might be,
[01:40:11] ▶and what market rents are might be more than the increase
[01:40:17] ▶in their income. So that seems like a perverse incentive.
[01:40:20] ▶And so I think it's just another downside of the inclusionary zoning requirements. So,
[01:40:25] ▶I think that's
[01:40:26] ▶a questionable policy that I think we should look at. But, that's beside the point. I think
[01:40:31] ▶this is a good project. I think we need more housing along 10th. I really wish I could be sort of full YIMBY and actually speak in favor of housing in my right across from me.
[01:40:41] ▶But unfortunately,
[01:40:42] ▶the Broadway plan doesn't allow it. So I'm speaking in favor of the the proposals that are closest to me,
[01:40:48] ▶and that includes this one. So, yeah, please support this proposal,
[01:40:51] ▶and
[01:40:52] ▶let's have more, rezoning so we don't have to sit through this all the time. Thanks. Bye. Thanks. Alright. We have two more speakers on the line. The first speaker's,
[01:41:02] ▶Speaker 0: last four digit of the phone number is 8976.
[01:41:07] ▶Speaker 25: Yes. Hi. My name is William. I'm a resident of Vancouver.
[01:41:12] ▶I did
[01:41:13] ▶provide some feedback, but tonight I'm hearing about this yellow memo that I had not heard about. And I did look at the website this morning, and it was not there. So I'm a bit surprised as to where this change,
[01:41:27] ▶and seeming removal of the affordable housing was that was in this proposal.
[01:41:32] ▶And, I think a lot of the people who have provided feedback
[01:41:36] ▶are
[01:41:37] ▶well,
[01:41:38] ▶either their feedback didn't consider this, and this is quite a significant change that should have been,
[01:41:45] ▶given more time for feedback from the community.
[01:41:48] ▶It's procedurally unfair,
[01:41:50] ▶and,
[01:41:51] ▶such a significant change should not have been uploaded the day of the hearing. So that is my feedback. Thank you.
[01:41:58] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you. The next speaker is last four digits is, 7269.
[01:42:10] ▶Speaker, are you on the line? Last four digits, 7269.
[01:42:20] ▶Oh, there's one more.
[01:42:23] ▶K. Is this one online?
[01:42:26] ▶6284.
[01:42:32] ▶Because
[01:42:33] ▶last four digits, 6284.
[01:42:35] ▶Are you online?
[01:42:37] ▶I am on the line. Yes. Yeah. Please go ahead. Please state your name and you if you are resident of Vancouver, and you have five minutes. Please go ahead.
[01:42:45] ▶Speaker 36: Okay. My name is Danny, and I am a resident and owner at the Habitat Building,
[01:42:51] ▶which is right behind
[01:42:52] ▶the the proposed development.
[01:42:54] ▶Prior to purchasing,
[01:42:56] ▶I was a long time renter. And while I'm in support of affordable housing and community,
[01:43:02] ▶I oppose this project.
[01:43:05] ▶Mainly
[01:43:06] ▶speaking from our experience, my wife and I had experienced firsthand the stress of trying to get our daughter into kindergarten.
[01:43:14] ▶Both schools in the area
[01:43:16] ▶were considered overflow schools prior to 2024,
[01:43:20] ▶which means kids who couldn't get into the schools in their catchments
[01:43:24] ▶would go to Nightingale and Mount Pleasant School, and now both schools are full.
[01:43:29] ▶And beyond construction
[01:43:31] ▶and a clear plan on how to mitigate access and supporting businesses like AM Cafe,
[01:43:38] ▶so they can only so they can not only survive but thrive.
[01:43:41] ▶I wanted to know what thought was being put in towards the schools
[01:43:46] ▶and infrastructure.
[01:43:48] ▶And as I said, I support housing when it is thoughtful,
[01:43:51] ▶and there is a clear plan around infrastructure.
[01:43:56] ▶Speaker 0: And that's all. Thank you. Thank you. Alright. So, Clerk, do we have any other speakers in the chamber or on the line?
[01:44:05] ▶We do not, chair. K. Thanks. Seeing no further speakers, the speakers list is now closed.
[01:44:10] ▶Clerk, has there been a large volume of public comments received on this item after 5PM?
[01:44:20] ▶Speaker 5: There has not been. K. Thank you.
[01:44:22] ▶Speaker 0: Okay. Seeing there are few or no public comments received after 5PM,
[01:44:26] ▶I'm also closing the the receipt of, public comments.
[01:44:36] ▶Does the applicant have any closing comments?
[01:44:40] ▶No? Okay. Does our staff have any closing comments?
[01:44:45] ▶Speaker 4: Yes, chair. We have some closing comments. So we just wanna thank you for the opportunity to present today. We want to follow-up with a couple items that were raised during the pres today's presentation and question period.
[01:44:56] ▶Firstly,
[01:44:57] ▶we spoke to clerks and clerk clerks have confirmed that the old memo was posted online on February 12.
[01:45:04] ▶And secondly,
[01:45:06] ▶in general, with with respect to the BMR,
[01:45:10] ▶units, these units count towards our below market housing targets,
[01:45:13] ▶and staff will continue to ensure that the targets reported meet the provincial definitions for reporting.
[01:45:19] ▶Speaker 12: Thank you. Thank you. Alright.
[01:45:22] ▶Speaker 0: Does, council have any final question for staff noting
[01:45:25] ▶no additional comments, comments or question to the applicant are permitted?
[01:45:30] ▶Councilor Meisner.
[01:45:31] ▶Speaker 39: Yeah. Thanks, chair. Thanks, staff, for the, clarification on the yellow memo.
[01:45:35] ▶My other question was, some of the speakers raised concerns around access,
[01:45:39] ▶to the parkade of their building,
[01:45:41] ▶which I understand is on Broadway,
[01:45:44] ▶as well as some business owners. Can staff comment on that, what will be maintained?
[01:45:48] ▶I know, we can't ask the applicant anymore, but, I'm just looking for some insight that you might have. Yes, counselor. Thanks very much for the question. I'll I'll ask my colleague from engineering to address that.
[01:46:01] ▶Speaker 40: Hi. Thanks so much. Daniel Klein, engineering services.
[01:46:04] ▶Can I just clarify? Did you mean access from the lane or access from Broadway itself? Access from the lane and also access on Guelph. Yeah. Thanks so much. So,
[01:46:13] ▶the,
[01:46:14] ▶I know there's been a number of comments about concern about the, construction
[01:46:18] ▶logistics.
[01:46:19] ▶That's typically something that's addressed later in the development process. This is fairly early, although it sounds like from the applicant's opening comments, they're being quite proactive in interacting with,
[01:46:29] ▶the current residents.
[01:46:30] ▶We have several,
[01:46:33] ▶processes in place to help mitigate impacts of construction. That includes,
[01:46:38] ▶temporary street use permits,
[01:46:40] ▶trans
[01:46:42] ▶traffic management plans. So we work closely with the applicant,
[01:46:46] ▶again, later in the process to help mitigate those concerns. So
[01:46:49] ▶critical when, the city is evaluating those proposals is safety,
[01:46:54] ▶as well as access.
[01:46:56] ▶And so, typically,
[01:46:58] ▶the applicant, the city, and if there's other stakeholders in this case, that would be the adjacent building.
[01:47:04] ▶We're together to make sure there's a workable plan. Okay. So they'll have an opportunity to provide
[01:47:09] ▶Speaker 39: feedback or input on that plan, or or will there be engagement with neighboring buildings, residents on that plan?
[01:47:15] ▶Speaker 40: It sounds like the applicant has already been engaging.
[01:47:17] ▶I'm not too familiar if there's,
[01:47:20] ▶critical engagement, but because the comments have already come in, it's likely we would,
[01:47:24] ▶make sure to elicit that feedback.
[01:47:26] ▶Speaker 1: Okay. Yeah. Okay. Great. Thank you. Thanks. Thanks. Councilor Claussen. Thanks very much, chair. My questions are entirely along the same line, so you've answered them for me. So I don't think you need to repeat your answers. But just because the applicant is here, and then we did hear a few questions and comments about access and and, and potential obstructions laying during construction. I know that, those things will be mitigated. It's just important, I think, to reiterate,
[01:47:49] ▶that we heard those things, and we hope that they're addressed, during construction.
[01:47:53] ▶Period. Thanks very much.
[01:47:55] ▶Speaker 0: No more questions? Question from here, Rich.
[01:47:58] ▶Okay. Good. K. Thanks. Councilor Warr.
[01:48:01] ▶Speaker 8: Yeah. Thanks for answering the question on the yellow memo.
[01:48:05] ▶It is concerning that some people thought it was posted today
[01:48:08] ▶more than one person, so I don't know how that got, that confusion came about.
[01:48:13] ▶But, I was just wondering more sort of on even if it did come out on the twelfth and then the con consultation would have been,
[01:48:20] ▶before that.
[01:48:22] ▶So, essentially,
[01:48:23] ▶the the concern that people were consulted on 20%,
[01:48:26] ▶below market
[01:48:28] ▶and that now it's 20% average. I don't know if, Josh, if you wanna say anything about that.
[01:48:34] ▶Speaker 17: Sure, councilor. Yeah. I I think it's,
[01:48:37] ▶fair comment to say,
[01:48:40] ▶when,
[01:48:41] ▶there's a policy change that's affected, for example, citywide or as part participant policy area and it applies sort of to an in stream application,
[01:48:51] ▶by its nature, some of those changes
[01:48:53] ▶will happen later in the process than they would if they were a long standing policy.
[01:48:58] ▶We endeavor to be as transparent as possible.
[01:49:01] ▶The yellow memo is a method to,
[01:49:04] ▶make sure that that is public information prior to the public hearing, which is, of course, itself an integral part of the consultation
[01:49:13] ▶and consideration process for US decision makers.
[01:49:17] ▶So,
[01:49:18] ▶while we would,
[01:49:20] ▶always like those those policy changes to be apparent or evident,
[01:49:25] ▶earlier in the process as part of public consultation. That's not always possible depending on when those policy changes happen.
[01:49:32] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you. K. Thanks.
[01:49:34] ▶Alright. So, Clerk, did we receive any additional public comments since the close of the public comments?
[01:49:43] ▶You did not. K. Thanks. So I will remind counsel that we need to move the recommendations for item one, together with the yellow memo
[01:49:51] ▶dated 02/10/2026
[01:49:54] ▶entitled the city one rezoning,
[01:49:56] ▶4532461
[01:49:58] ▶East,
[01:49:59] ▶10th Avenue and 25362542
[01:50:03] ▶Guelph Street amendments to the housing condition.
[01:50:06] ▶Council will not make, the decision on this application.
[01:50:10] ▶We will have a mover for this, recommendation on the yellow memo. Move by councilor Klassen, second by councilor Meissner. Council members, are there any discussions?
[01:50:20] ▶Hey. Councilor Claussen?
[01:50:22] ▶Speaker 1: Yeah. Just a few,
[01:50:23] ▶brief remarks.
[01:50:25] ▶First of all, I wanna thank all the speakers who spoke tonight.
[01:50:28] ▶Wide range of,
[01:50:30] ▶topics and concerns.
[01:50:32] ▶But, it was good to hear some of the support for this project. Some of the comments I heard on on either side were were very thoughtful.
[01:50:39] ▶I also just wanna acknowledge that the yellow memorandum was added late to the site of my fully recognized pressure, the current economic
[01:50:46] ▶conditions are placing on the viability of rental development across the city, and we're seeing it play out in real time. I don't think anyone,
[01:50:54] ▶deserves anyone to ignore it. So it it's just important to acknowledge that the adjustment for before us does reduce the depth of below market affordability compared to what was originally proposed.
[01:51:04] ▶That's worth noting, and it's something I think it continues to pay,
[01:51:08] ▶that I continue to pay close attention to it as we consider these applications.
[01:51:12] ▶That said, this change,
[01:51:14] ▶is tied to a citywide relief program,
[01:51:17] ▶that, council,
[01:51:20] ▶and, approved by council is conditional on the project moving forward in a timely way.
[01:51:26] ▶If the project does
[01:51:27] ▶not advance and deeper affordability requirements remain in place.
[01:51:32] ▶This project delivers much needed rental housing, including family sized units and below market homes in an area that, is well served by,
[01:51:41] ▶transit and identified for growth under the Broadway plan, which is being straight and obviously very important.
[01:51:47] ▶I appreciated the discussion around neighborhood fit. There was, some good questions and and responses,
[01:51:53] ▶from the applicant from staff.
[01:51:55] ▶And while no project is impact free, I'm satisfied the staff have applied appropriate conditions to address scale, massing, and servicing, and these are enforceable and not aspirational.
[01:52:06] ▶Also, but wanna particularly hike the decision to to animate the laneway, which I think makes this project stand out,
[01:52:12] ▶with commercial uses. Too often, lanes have become sort of a back of house service corridors, and this project treats,
[01:52:19] ▶lanes in this particular area,
[01:52:22] ▶as a, an ability to improve the public realm,
[01:52:26] ▶and making it more safe, lively, and obviously,
[01:52:30] ▶provide some, people and neighbors,
[01:52:33] ▶access to that part of of the neighborhood in a in a more robust way. So for me, this is an example of how added density can come with better urban outcomes and when design and mitigation are taken seriously.
[01:52:44] ▶And for those reasons, I'm, comfortable in supporting this application. Thank you. K. Thanks, councilor. Councilor Meisner. Yeah. I'll be quick.
[01:52:52] ▶Speaker 39: I, wanted to thank all speakers for, coming today and speaking to the project.
[01:52:57] ▶And I was glad to hear, that the concerns,
[01:53:00] ▶concerns raised tonight around parking and access,
[01:53:03] ▶will be addressed by the city and the applicant at a later state. And, it appeared to me that that feedback was, clearly, heard by staff, and I know the applicant is, committed
[01:53:12] ▶to continuing continuing to engage with the community.
[01:53:16] ▶Like councilor Klassen, I think this is a good project, which will add, a lot of rental homes,
[01:53:21] ▶including blue market rental and a retail space,
[01:53:24] ▶which I think will be a great amenity for the neighborhood.
[01:53:27] ▶And I also appreciated the attention, that's paid to the tree retention.
[01:53:32] ▶Those trees on,
[01:53:33] ▶on on 10th are beautiful, and, we wanna re retain those.
[01:53:38] ▶And I also appreciated,
[01:53:39] ▶the plans to animate the laneway because I think there's lots of potential there and the measures,
[01:53:44] ▶that will also be taken on tenths to ensure, no impact on the bike lane. So all in all, I think given this project's location just a couple blocks from the future Mount Pleasant, Broadway Line SkyTrain Station,
[01:53:55] ▶this makes a lot of sense, and I'm happy to support it tonight.
[01:53:59] ▶Speaker 0: Thanks. Councilor Orr.
[01:54:01] ▶Speaker 8: Yeah. Again, I'll be brief.
[01:54:03] ▶I was also really excited,
[01:54:05] ▶about this application when I when I saw it.
[01:54:08] ▶It looks like a really great project.
[01:54:10] ▶The POPs look great,
[01:54:11] ▶activating the laneway and all that.
[01:54:15] ▶I I think that,
[01:54:17] ▶the,
[01:54:19] ▶the lack of consultation on on the,
[01:54:22] ▶the yellow memo just raises a few questions for me.
[01:54:25] ▶And I I definitely would love to see that the 20% below market. I understand the viability and the rental relief program,
[01:54:33] ▶but, I just think it just raises a few questions on the consultation, so happy to support,
[01:54:39] ▶in a way
[01:54:40] ▶that,
[01:54:41] ▶also addresses my, reservations.
[01:54:45] ▶Speaker 0: K. Thank you.
[01:54:47] ▶Okay. I'm go I'm going to call the vote.
[01:54:50] ▶Clerk, please take us to the voting screen, and counsel please register your vote.
[01:54:55] ▶Speaker 9: K. Can I have a vote assist in favor, please, canceled for BM? Yes. Noted.
[01:55:01] ▶Speaker 33: Clerks also take a vote assist in favor. Thank you.
[01:55:04] ▶Speaker 0: K. Thank you. Alright. So this,
[01:55:08] ▶project passed with counselor Orr abstain and mayor's seen absent.
[01:55:13] ▶Thank you.
[01:55:19] ▶Alright. Thanks. That completes, the first item on agenda.
[01:55:23] ▶The second item is, CD one,
[01:55:26] ▶bracket five nineteen tax amendment,
[01:55:29] ▶Gaming Control Act approval,
[01:55:31] ▶39 To 65 Smythe Street.
[01:55:35] ▶Before we begin this agenda item, if anyone believes they have a conflict of interest, now is the time to declare it. Does anyone have a conflict of interest to disclose?
[01:55:44] ▶And seeing none, the clerk will now read the application and the summary of respondents
[01:55:48] ▶received.
[01:55:49] ▶Speaker 6: This is an application by Park Holding Limited Partnership
[01:55:53] ▶to amend the CD one district five one nine by law number one zero four zero four and to approve the application submitted by the BCLC
[01:56:02] ▶pursuant to the Gaming Control Act, GCA,
[01:56:05] ▶to increase the number of permitted slot machines from 600
[01:56:09] ▶to 900
[01:56:10] ▶of the site at 3965
[01:56:12] ▶Smythe Street, the park casino.
[01:56:15] ▶The GCA requires the host local government to satisfy the BCLC
[01:56:20] ▶that adequate community input has been sought and considered prior to deciding on an application to substantially change
[01:56:25] ▶the
[01:56:26] ▶type
[01:56:27] ▶or
[01:56:28] ▶extent of a gaming facility.
[01:56:30] ▶The city has been advised
[01:56:32] ▶that a public hearing is satisfactory consultation for this
[01:56:34] ▶purpose.
[01:56:36] ▶There are no form of development changes proposed to the existing building. The general manager of planning, urban design, and sustainability The general manager of planning, urban design, and sustainability
[01:56:43] ▶recommends approval
[01:56:45] ▶subject to conditions set out in the summary and recommendation.
[01:56:48] ▶The following correspondence has been received since referral to public hearing.
[01:56:53] ▶Seven pieces of correspondence and support and 60 pieces of correspondence and opposition.
[01:56:59] ▶This represents all correspondence received up to 5PM today.
[01:57:04] ▶Speaker 0: Thank you. This is the first call for speakers. If you wish to speak to council about this item, please call toll free +1 (833)
[01:57:11] ▶353-8610
[01:57:14] ▶followed by the participant code 1061445Pound
[01:57:18] ▶before the close of the speakers list. The phone number will be posted on x and displayed during the recess.
[01:57:25] ▶There will be an opportunity for new speakers and the missed speakers to be heard at the end of the registered speakers list. We have staff on planning urban designs that's sustainability here to present the application. Please go ahead.
[01:57:38] ▶Speaker 41: Good evening, mayor and council. My name is Susanna Ruhl, and I'm the reasoning planner for the CD one text amendment application under the Gaming Control Act for thirty nine to sixty sixty five Smythe Street.
[01:57:48] ▶I'm here with my colleague, Jody Cedar Jones, who will present these applications with me today.
[01:57:54] ▶The site shown in red is located on the northeast corner of Pacific Boulevard and Smythe Street. BC Places BC Place Stadium is to the east of the site. The site is surrounded by City 1 zones with downtown dis downtown district zones further to the north.
[01:58:09] ▶The construction of park casino was completed in 2017.
[01:58:12] ▶The building contains retail space, office, hotel, restaurants, and a casino.
[01:58:18] ▶This site is located within the Northeast Falls Creek plan. The plan was approved in 2018 after the development of Park Casino.
[01:58:28] ▶The report also evaluates
[01:58:29] ▶an application by the BC Lottery Corporation,
[01:58:32] ▶BCLC, pursuant to the Gaming Control Act. Under the Gaming Control Act, the BCLC must receive approval from the host go host local government
[01:58:41] ▶prior to substantially changing the extent of lottery schemes at the gaming facility.
[01:58:46] ▶This includes increasing the number of slot machines.
[01:58:49] ▶It also requires the host local government to seek adequate community input and consultation with each potentially affected local government,
[01:58:57] ▶including First Nations.
[01:58:59] ▶In addition, in 2011, council adopted a moratorium on expansions of gambling and gaming facilities in the city.
[01:59:05] ▶The moratorium was amended in 2024.
[01:59:08] ▶The amendment enables applications to substantially change the substantially change the extent of lottery schemes at existing gaming facilities.
[01:59:15] ▶Council directed that applicants are required to provide a full health, safety, and economic impact assessment of their proposals so staff can analyze the impacts
[01:59:23] ▶of the gambling expansion.
[01:59:25] ▶Council also directed staff to explore opportunities to increase the social responsibility fund and or other related funds to ex to address the impacts of any proposals.
[01:59:36] ▶The rezoning proposal is to amend the CD one by law to permit the increase of the permitted slot machines from 600 to 900. The Gaming Control Act application makes the same request.
[01:59:46] ▶There are no form of development changes proposed to the existing building.
[01:59:56] ▶Speaker 42: Good evening. I'm Jody Snyder Jones, managing director for social policy and projects,
[02:00:00] ▶to turn now to the health impact assessment.
[02:00:03] ▶The applicant undertook and submitted a health impact assessment as required, and in order to ensure council's decision on the proposed expansion
[02:00:12] ▶is informed by an understanding of the health, economic, and safety risks arising from gambling and casino operations.
[02:00:19] ▶Staff reviewed the HIA in collaboration with key partners and found it to be strong in its framing and identification
[02:00:26] ▶of key issues.
[02:00:27] ▶The applicant's HIA defines health holistically
[02:00:31] ▶using a social determinants of health lens
[02:00:34] ▶and follows standard processes established through the literature through the literature
[02:00:39] ▶and identifies problem gambling,
[02:00:41] ▶I e, persistent gambling behavior that leads to significant financial, social, or mental health harm as a central health risk.
[02:00:50] ▶It also sets out both potential benefits and anticipated harms or risks from the proposed expansion.
[02:00:57] ▶Benefits identified in the HIA include increased potential for revenue generation, expanded job creation,
[02:01:04] ▶and enhanced leisure or entertainment value.
[02:01:07] ▶Anticipated risks and harms related to gambling and problem gambling identified in the HIA
[02:01:13] ▶include proportionate economic, health, and social related harms,
[02:01:17] ▶with notation of further disproportionate
[02:01:20] ▶impacts on socioeconomically
[02:01:22] ▶vulnerable groups and higher risk players,
[02:01:25] ▶and an understanding that these individual impacts can have broader social effects.
[02:01:32] ▶As stated, the health impact assessment submitted by the applicant frames the key issues.
[02:01:37] ▶It clearly sets out both potential benefits and anticipated harms from the proposed expansion.
[02:01:43] ▶However, staff found that the HIA was limited in providing quantitative estimates of the likely magnitude of expected risks and harms.
[02:01:51] ▶In a complementary analysis, staff found that the expansion has the potential to generate additional revenue and employment as well as entertainment benefits
[02:01:59] ▶for an estimated 200,000
[02:02:01] ▶non problem gamblers over the next five years,
[02:02:04] ▶with an additional roughly 6,000 net new patrons projected to fall into low to higher risk categories
[02:02:10] ▶of individ of individual problem gambling over the same period.
[02:02:15] ▶Staff note that harms associated with the proposed increase from 600 to 900 slot machines are not negligible,
[02:02:22] ▶as slot machines present a moderately higher risk form of gambling,
[02:02:26] ▶particularly for already vulnerable groups.
[02:02:29] ▶And staff confirmed the HIE's findings that there is the potential for proportionate indirect impacts to others and potential for increased demand for health and social services.
[02:02:39] ▶Staff also recognize that the applicant has been implementing mitigation measures since it began operations
[02:02:44] ▶as part of the responsible gaming agreement with the city and as part of BCLC responsible gaming programs.
[02:02:51] ▶These measures include staff training, accreditation,
[02:02:54] ▶player health policies,
[02:02:55] ▶and on-site measures, including a Game Sense information center on the casino floor.
[02:03:01] ▶The applicant has committed to retaining and or enhancing measures going forward to ensure adequate security and safety for patrons and neighbors alike.
[02:03:13] ▶As part of staff analysis and consultation on the HIA, staff met with Vancouver Coastal Health and Vancouver Police Department
[02:03:20] ▶and the key health care research partners as defined in the Responsible Gaming Agreement.
[02:03:26] ▶Insights from these discussions were incorporated
[02:03:28] ▶into analysis and assessment.
[02:03:31] ▶This includes advice on effective mitigation and enhancement measures that are aligned with health and safety standards and
[02:03:37] ▶proportionate to assessed degrees of risk or harms.
[02:03:41] ▶With Vancouver Coastal Health, the conversations were focused around public health implications.
[02:03:46] ▶The Vancouver Police Department advised on safety considerations with a focused concern on crime rates in the vicinity of the
[02:03:53] ▶casino, and key health care research partners named in the existing responsible gaming agreement identified suitable amendments as needed if the slot machine expansion were to be approved. Stakeholders included Saint Paul's Foundation, the UBC Centre for Gambling Research, and the BC Centre for Substance Use. The partners also agreed that research, monitoring, and evaluation should continue to focus on potential harms associated with the casino and its expansion.
[02:04:19] ▶To implement these additional measures, staff proposed that an increase in investments
[02:04:23] ▶proportionate to potential impacts resulting from the proposed expansion are required to monitor and address the impacts from the expansion.
[02:04:36] ▶Speaker 41: For the public consultation of the Rezoning and Gaming Control Act applications, approximately
[02:04:41] ▶40 submissions were received. Comments showed a mix of support and concern regarding the proposed increase in slot machines at Park Casino.
[02:04:48] ▶Supportive feedback highlighted Park Casino as a value city asset, the need for more gaming variety to stay competitive with nearby casinos, and the potential for increased revenue to benefit city services.
[02:04:59] ▶Concerns expressed centered on gambling related harm, neighborhood safety and livability, and lack of community benefits.
[02:05:06] ▶Regarding gambling impacts, the applicant has applicant has been implementing mitigation measures since it began operations as part of the responsible gaming
[02:05:15] ▶agreement and BCLC programs as men as mentioned previously.
[02:05:19] ▶The applicant is being asked to increase the mitigation
[02:05:21] ▶measures, monitoring, and fund contributions to offset these increased risks.
[02:05:26] ▶Regarding neighborhood safety, given the known health and safety concerns arising from problem gambling and casino operations, it's critical to consider these impacts when assessing any proposed expansion.
[02:05:37] ▶According to the Vancouver Police Department, the largest impacts on police statistics occurred when Park Casino opened and receded after. The Vancouver police department believes that any future impact due to the increase in the number of slot machines should be less of should be less significant.
[02:05:54] ▶Regarding lack of community benefits, additional gaming related municipal revenues and fund contributions have the potential to increase health and social value, as well as leading to a small increase in employment and associated wages and benefits.
[02:06:08] ▶Furthermore, additional slot machines will provide expanded gambling options closer to home for casual players who primarily use the game the casino for recreation
[02:06:17] ▶and socializing and are not at risk of problem gambling.
[02:06:21] ▶The applicant has offered to increase the total contribution under the existing responsible gaming gaming agreement from 600,000
[02:06:28] ▶annually to 750,000
[02:06:31] ▶in 2027
[02:06:32] ▶and 900,000
[02:06:33] ▶in 2028
[02:06:34] ▶and future years,
[02:06:36] ▶subject to annual inflation adjustments after 2028.
[02:06:39] ▶The existing agreement provides both a contribution to the city's social responsibility
[02:06:44] ▶fund and a research payment contribution to the St. Paul's Foundation made in the name of the city.
[02:06:49] ▶The applicant's contribution will be centralized, and the city will manage disbursement
[02:06:54] ▶for related research purposes through city granting processes. In addition, under the terms of the host financial assistance agreement, the city receives 10% of the net revenue from the facility's gambling operations each year.
[02:07:07] ▶The applicant has estimated that the proposed expansion of slot machines at the park casino is expected to result in approximately 3,000,000 of additional revenue over the first three years or roughly $1,000,000
[02:07:18] ▶per year for a total benefit of approximately $8,000,000
[02:07:21] ▶annually.
[02:07:22] ▶This number is projected by the applicant to grow over time.
[02:07:27] ▶In conclusion, staff recommend approval of the rezoning and gaming control act applications
[02:07:32] ▶subject to the conditions outlined in appendix b of the report contingent on mitigation measures monitoring and targeting use of contributed funds with the understanding that these cannot fully offset the underlying risk. Staff and the applicant team are available to answer questions. Thank you. K. Thank you. Okay. So would the applicant like to present the application?
[02:07:56] ▶Speaker 43: Good evening, counsel. My name is Pat Davis. I'm the president and CEO of BCLC.
[02:08:01] ▶Tonight, I am joined by Karen Gray, who is the vice president of marketing for Park Casino.
[02:08:07] ▶Park Casino is part of a world class resort located in a world class entertainment destination, the city of Vancouver.
[02:08:15] ▶Park Casino is frequented and enjoyed by Vancouverites and city visitors, hosting two hotels, eight restaurants, and lounges.
[02:08:23] ▶I can tell you that Park is an amazing partner for us at BCLC and continues to share in our commitment to supporting the health and well-being of our players and our communities.
[02:08:33] ▶So thank you for the opportunity to be here tonight.
[02:08:36] ▶As you know, we are seeking rezoning of 3965
[02:08:40] ▶Smythe Street to allow for an increase in the maximum permitted slot machines
[02:08:44] ▶from 600 to 900 at Park Casino, along with the related Gaming Control Act application.
[02:08:50] ▶The request of both applications is straightforward.
[02:08:54] ▶Increased slot capacity by 300
[02:08:56] ▶from 600 to 900 within the existing
[02:08:59] ▶park casino.
[02:09:00] ▶And these applications follow the principle that this council set in 2024
[02:09:05] ▶that any gaming enhancements
[02:09:07] ▶occur only within existing facilities.
[02:09:11] ▶At BCLC,
[02:09:12] ▶our vision is to revolutionize gambling entertainment
[02:09:15] ▶through engaging experiences
[02:09:17] ▶that build and benefit communities
[02:09:20] ▶communities.
[02:09:21] ▶I emphasize that because both BCLC and Park
[02:09:24] ▶are proud to be part of this one right here in Vancouver.
[02:09:29] ▶BCLC exists to
[02:09:31] ▶serve the public interest accountable to communities we support
[02:09:35] ▶and not simply to operate gaming facilities.
[02:09:38] ▶Thanks to profits of play, last year alone,
[02:09:41] ▶$1,400,000,000
[02:09:43] ▶in BCLC net income was returned to the province to be invested in vital public programs,
[02:09:49] ▶including health care and education
[02:09:52] ▶across the entire province.
[02:09:54] ▶More focused here in Vancouver, however, in addition to the host local government revenue that the city receives for hosting casinos,
[02:10:02] ▶BCLC net income benefits many community and nonprofit organizations
[02:10:07] ▶right here.
[02:10:08] ▶In fact, so far this fiscal year, almost 500
[02:10:13] ▶nonprofits in Vancouver
[02:10:15] ▶have received nearly
[02:10:16] ▶$17,000,000
[02:10:18] ▶through the province's community gaming grants program that support the incredible work that they do in this community
[02:10:25] ▶every day.
[02:10:26] ▶BCLC is also proud to sponsor
[02:10:29] ▶many Vancouver events and experiences
[02:10:31] ▶and places to bring the community together.
[02:10:34] ▶This is for connection,
[02:10:36] ▶entertainment, and purpose.
[02:10:38] ▶This, of course, includes the new BCLC backyard area of the Freedom Mobile Arch at the PNE,
[02:10:44] ▶which we're very excited
[02:10:46] ▶to help celebrate when it opens this summer.
[02:10:50] ▶It's been great to support the city and watch it grow and evolve over the past number of years,
[02:10:55] ▶but a lot has changed in the city since you placed a limit on the number of slot machines in Vancouver
[02:11:00] ▶fifteen years ago.
[02:11:02] ▶Since that time, the city's population has grown by more than 20%
[02:11:07] ▶while local casino capacity has remained
[02:11:09] ▶the same.
[02:11:11] ▶And that means that many Vancouver players are leaving the city to play elsewhere
[02:11:17] ▶because the casinos here are not meeting their expectations.
[02:11:21] ▶We know that most players potentially impacted
[02:11:24] ▶by the requested change are already gambling,
[02:11:27] ▶but are doing so outside of Vancouver.
[02:11:31] ▶In fact, 71%
[02:11:33] ▶of BCLC's
[02:11:34] ▶gambling revenue from Vancouver players
[02:11:37] ▶is actually flowing through other Lower Mainland casinos.
[02:11:41] ▶That means, simply put,
[02:11:43] ▶that the city is losing out on important revenue
[02:11:46] ▶from its own residents.
[02:11:49] ▶Without supporting the ability for Park Casino to expand and meet market expectations
[02:11:54] ▶through more slot machines,
[02:11:55] ▶Vancouver will continue to see local players
[02:11:58] ▶and their economic activity
[02:12:00] ▶leaving the city.
[02:12:02] ▶Over the past fifteen years, the gambling market has also shifted significantly.
[02:12:07] ▶In particular,
[02:12:09] ▶it's broadened with the growth of digital gambling and betting.
[02:12:13] ▶Online gambling can be accessed by any adult that has a mobile phone.
[02:12:17] ▶Apart from BCLC's
[02:12:19] ▶play now, which is legal and regulated in BC, there are over 800
[02:12:24] ▶sites operating here and in Canada illegally.
[02:12:28] ▶These sites do not have the player health and safety supports that other or other regulatory obligations
[02:12:35] ▶that are required for every single BC casino.
[02:12:40] ▶And we take these obligations
[02:12:42] ▶along with our commitments
[02:12:43] ▶to grow responsibly
[02:12:45] ▶with player health at the forefront
[02:12:47] ▶incredibly seriously.
[02:12:49] ▶Most British Columbian adults who gamble do so for fun and entertainment,
[02:12:53] ▶and we want to reassure
[02:12:55] ▶that there are robust support systems in place for everyone
[02:12:59] ▶who are engaging with our products, including those who may have challenges with our products.
[02:13:05] ▶We know, however, that some residents
[02:13:08] ▶still have concerns about the health and social impacts of gambling.
[02:13:13] ▶So I wanna touch briefly on the strong safeguards we have in place,
[02:13:17] ▶the independent validation behind them, and how we continue to raise expectations through continuous improvement.
[02:13:25] ▶DCLC respects that everyone experiences gambling differently,
[02:13:29] ▶and we wanna encourage people that gamble to do so in a regulated environment like park
[02:13:35] ▶because we have robust safeguards to promote safer play.
[02:13:39] ▶In 2023,
[02:13:41] ▶BC became the first lottery jurisdiction in North America to implement mandatory
[02:13:47] ▶ID requirements to enter all of our casinos.
[02:13:51] ▶In short, this is to prevent people from entering the casino who should not be there,
[02:13:56] ▶including those who have taken pardon me, have chosen to take a break from gambling
[02:14:01] ▶as part of our game break self exclusion program.
[02:14:05] ▶You might have also heard about our widely adopted award winning player health program called Game Sense
[02:14:11] ▶that promotes responsible gambling through education
[02:14:14] ▶and includes in person
[02:14:16] ▶Game Sense advisors in casinos in Cross BC
[02:14:20] ▶and is also available
[02:14:22] ▶virtually online.
[02:14:25] ▶Eric and Mike
[02:14:26] ▶are the dedicated advisors at Park Casino for this program.
[02:14:31] ▶And due to its success,
[02:14:33] ▶BCLC
[02:14:34] ▶licenses Game Sense to several North American jurisdictions.
[02:14:38] ▶MGM Resorts International
[02:14:40] ▶is just one example of this.
[02:14:43] ▶So our Game Sense advisors have the important role of educating our players to support safer play
[02:14:49] ▶or refer to them to treatment and support if they're experiencing challenges.
[02:14:54] ▶So I've highlighted just a couple of examples
[02:14:57] ▶of our player health program, which overall has supported BCLC
[02:15:01] ▶to achieve and maintain
[02:15:03] ▶the highest level
[02:15:05] ▶of responsible gaming certification by the World Lottery Association
[02:15:09] ▶for five consecutive three year terms.
[02:15:13] ▶Our program was recognized in 2023
[02:15:16] ▶as the world leader in this type of programming.
[02:15:20] ▶It is most recent assessment.
[02:15:22] ▶Park Casino also received one of the highest scores ever achieved by a BC Casino from RG Check, a responsible gambling accreditation program that is currently mandated
[02:15:33] ▶in the covenants with the City of Vancouver.
[02:15:36] ▶Parc was also recognized by RG Check as the number one casino in North America
[02:15:42] ▶and number two in the world
[02:15:45] ▶for player health best practices.
[02:15:48] ▶Above and beyond compliance standards, Park has instituted its own player health initiatives, including additional training for new employees and marketing staff, responsible gambling tools to set limits on cash advances,
[02:16:00] ▶and recognition of staff who engage in player health best practices.
[02:16:06] ▶All of this
[02:16:07] ▶reflects our shared deep and enduring commitment
[02:16:11] ▶to player health,
[02:16:12] ▶not just to meet requirements,
[02:16:14] ▶but to raise the bar.
[02:16:16] ▶And with that,
[02:16:17] ▶Karen will share a few final words
[02:16:20] ▶about Park's commitment
[02:16:21] ▶here in Vancouver.
[02:16:23] ▶Speaker 0: Thanks. Please go ahead, Karen.
[02:16:26] ▶Speaker 44: Thank you.
[02:16:27] ▶Good evening.
[02:16:29] ▶At Park Casino, we have a saying that we are for Vancouver.
[02:16:34] ▶So to our team,
[02:16:36] ▶Vancouver is the place where we live, where we work, where we raise our kids, and where we play.
[02:16:42] ▶So for us, that means we believe that we have a responsibility
[02:16:46] ▶to be very proactive
[02:16:48] ▶about player health and safety culture,
[02:16:50] ▶as well as make community contributions,
[02:16:53] ▶partnerships,
[02:16:54] ▶and impact.
[02:16:56] ▶Last year alone, Park Casino
[02:17:00] ▶provided the city of Vancouver
[02:17:02] ▶more than $6,000,000
[02:17:04] ▶for hosting Park Casino.
[02:17:07] ▶Park has committed to increase contributions to the city's social responsibility
[02:17:11] ▶fund
[02:17:12] ▶by $300,000
[02:17:14] ▶per year.
[02:17:15] ▶This will bring Park's total contribution
[02:17:18] ▶to $900,000
[02:17:20] ▶should council
[02:17:21] ▶approve the rezoning application before you here tonight.
[02:17:26] ▶Since Park's inception in 2017,
[02:17:29] ▶money from this fund has gone into a wide range of city public services including parks and recreation,
[02:17:36] ▶the Vancouver Public Library,
[02:17:39] ▶and the Vancouver Fire and Rescue Services.
[02:17:43] ▶Park is also committed to expanding our For Vancouver program,
[02:17:47] ▶which provides donations,
[02:17:50] ▶fundraising facilities,
[02:17:51] ▶marketing support,
[02:17:53] ▶volunteering and repurposed clothes and linen
[02:17:57] ▶to non profits in the Vancouver area.
[02:18:00] ▶HAC regularly supports local partner organisations like the Vancouver Chinatown Foundation,
[02:18:06] ▶the Downtown Eastside Women's Centre, the Kettle Society,
[02:18:09] ▶the Doctor Peter Centre, the Veterans Transition Network,
[02:18:14] ▶and Filipino BC to help support dozens of community programs each year.
[02:18:20] ▶More than one quarter of our staff is made up of local neighbourhood residents.
[02:18:25] ▶Our inclusive hiring practices
[02:18:27] ▶target unemployed
[02:18:29] ▶and underemployed
[02:18:30] ▶adults in Vancouver
[02:18:31] ▶through partnerships and working with local non profits.
[02:18:36] ▶One anticipated economic benefit from the approval of this process
[02:18:40] ▶includes the creation of new local jobs, including two full time and 12 part time positions.
[02:18:48] ▶PARC also works to support the local economy through our procurement efforts.
[02:18:53] ▶More than 15% of our goods are sourced from vendors in the Downtown Eastside,
[02:18:58] ▶Strathcona,
[02:18:59] ▶and Mount Pleasant communities.
[02:19:02] ▶Like BCLC,
[02:19:04] ▶Park is part of the Vancouver community,
[02:19:07] ▶believes in the Vancouver community, and is committed to the Vancouver community.
[02:19:13] ▶In closing tonight, we ask that the council approve the applications before you.
[02:19:18] ▶The proposed expansion is a measured enhancement
[02:19:21] ▶within an existing facility.
[02:19:24] ▶One that keeps activities safe and regulated,
[02:19:28] ▶supports community benefit,
[02:19:30] ▶and reflects
[02:19:31] ▶the safeguards that Vancouver expects.
[02:19:34] ▶Thank you for your time, and we're happy to take questions. Thank you.
[02:19:38] ▶Speaker 0: K. Thanks.
[02:19:40] ▶Alright. So are there any question from council to staff or to the applicant, noting this is the only opportunity for council
[02:19:47] ▶to ask questions of the applicant.
[02:19:50] ▶Okay. So I'm the first. So I'll start with my question with the applicant.
[02:19:55] ▶So I guess that's the question for Park Casino first. So I think you mentioned that, there will be 12 14 jobs created, two part full time, 12 part time. Are those mainly union job union union workers?
[02:20:09] ▶Speaker 44: I don't have details on those,
[02:20:12] ▶Speaker 0: on that, but I would expect that they would be union workers largely. Yes. K. Thank you. And also the about, the social and the community benefits. Yep. I remember some, you know, nonprofit organization told me that they will frequently go to the casino
[02:20:27] ▶and do some work and receive some support financial support from the park casino. Can you elaborate more about that program?
[02:20:35] ▶Could you give me some more information, please? So I heard that they do contract work with the local casinos, and they can get some, financial support from the casinos through the I think it's a social responsibility agreement or something like that.
[02:20:50] ▶Speaker 44: I'm not sure about that program, but, we have our for Vancouver program, which gives a whole bunch of different benefits to community organizations. Mhmm.
[02:21:00] ▶So donations, marketing support, we provide venues.
[02:21:04] ▶We give donations to
[02:21:07] ▶I think, there were 15 different organizations
[02:21:10] ▶Speaker 0: in this past twelve months. K. Thank you. And, can you talk about the community engagement? Because we see some people who are here today opposing the project. You were complaining that there's not too many committee engagement throughout the process. Can you elaborate more about the engagement?
[02:21:25] ▶Speaker 44: Could I ask the city to answer that question? Okay. Maybe that's the city's question. Yeah. Thanks.
[02:21:30] ▶Speaker 41: For sure.
[02:21:31] ▶As explained in the presentation,
[02:21:34] ▶we did both the usual rezoning application
[02:21:37] ▶consultation that we always do with Shreveport City and,
[02:21:41] ▶postcard notifications,
[02:21:43] ▶online q and a periods, and then we have additional requirements under the Gaming Control Act for notifications.
[02:21:52] ▶Those include
[02:21:53] ▶letters to,
[02:21:54] ▶municipalities
[02:21:56] ▶around,
[02:21:57] ▶five kilometers around the location, which includes,
[02:22:01] ▶the First Nations,
[02:22:03] ▶Musqueam, Squamish, and Tsleil Waututh. And we sent a letter to Metro Vancouver as well as the city of North Vancouver.
[02:22:11] ▶During our analysis, we also engaged
[02:22:14] ▶with, community and and stakeholders.
[02:22:17] ▶Jody has been talking a little bit more about that.
[02:22:20] ▶And those included the,
[02:22:23] ▶the research partner that are named in a responsible gaming,
[02:22:26] ▶agreement as well as,
[02:22:28] ▶BCH
[02:22:29] ▶and the Vancouver
[02:22:31] ▶community department.
[02:22:33] ▶We received a lot of emails,
[02:22:35] ▶for the submissions, but I also received a couple phone calls from interested community people.
[02:22:42] ▶If you want
[02:22:44] ▶Speaker 0: ACCS to speak more to the stakeholder engagement, I can ask them to provide more details. But Okay. I'll ask this question later. I'm gonna focus on my question for to the applicant first. Thanks. So,
[02:22:54] ▶also question to to the applicant. So I think we have, the gambling addiction program. Can you elaborate more how we're gonna do the program to make sure that there's no gambling addiction?
[02:23:04] ▶Speaker 43: So BCLC obviously takes our player health,
[02:23:08] ▶commitments very, very seriously. And so we have a very, very robust
[02:23:11] ▶player health program.
[02:23:13] ▶So within the casino itself, we have dedicated advisors. So these are trained individuals
[02:23:19] ▶that are,
[02:23:20] ▶there to interact with players,
[02:23:23] ▶around
[02:23:24] ▶this topic and make sure that,
[02:23:27] ▶not only are they there to educate players, but also to be able to,
[02:23:32] ▶pass them over to treatment resources if necessary. Within the casino, all of the casino staff also take what's called appropriate response training. Part of that training
[02:23:40] ▶allows them to identify when players,
[02:23:43] ▶and patrons might be experiencing,
[02:23:46] ▶problematic
[02:23:47] ▶experiences and behavior and to intervene and to, again,
[02:23:51] ▶direct them to our player health and player,
[02:23:54] ▶behavioral,
[02:23:55] ▶programs. And so,
[02:23:57] ▶these are just a few of the number of safeguards that we have in place. We work very closely with our regulator as well, who oversees the overall
[02:24:06] ▶player, health and gambling treatment programs within the province.
[02:24:11] ▶Speaker 0: So those are, a few of the pieces that are in place for us. Thank you. Seems like more robust than our drug addiction program. Thanks. Okay. Other questions.
[02:24:22] ▶Do we know how many slot machines in, Richmond and Burnaby?
[02:24:27] ▶Speaker 43: I do. So,
[02:24:29] ▶let me just see if I have it here.
[02:24:39] ▶Speaker 0: Have fifteen seconds left.
[02:24:42] ▶Are we more than So, yes. Be
[02:24:45] ▶Speaker 43: Park Casino is the least dense,
[02:24:48] ▶of the,
[02:24:50] ▶casinos within the surrounding area. So River Rock, as an example, in Richmond, has over a thousand slot machines.
[02:24:57] ▶Both,
[02:24:58] ▶Grand Villa and Burnaby as well as Starlight New West have, more slot machines in the neighborhood of 900 to a thousand. I can ask, my colleagues to give me the exact number if you would like. K. Thanks. That's my time. Thank you so much. Hey. I'm gonna keep on going. Councilor Fry.
[02:25:16] ▶Speaker 7: Yeah.
[02:25:17] ▶Thank you, chair.
[02:25:19] ▶So, I I see from the the report, it talks about,
[02:25:24] ▶vulnerable populations,
[02:25:26] ▶South Asian, indigenous.
[02:25:28] ▶I don't see any mention of East Asian, and my understanding is there
[02:25:32] ▶is a prevalence of of problem gang gambling in the in the particularly in the Chinese seniors community. And, obviously, we have a vulnerable population quite close by. Can anybody speak to
[02:25:44] ▶where the omission of,
[02:25:46] ▶of,
[02:25:47] ▶East Asian folks is in this report?
[02:25:51] ▶Speaker 41: Is that for, staff or, the applicant?
[02:25:55] ▶Speaker 7: Well, I assume staff put it together, but it could be for the applicant if if the applicant was responsible for the data.
[02:26:00] ▶Speaker 43: I do have my director of player health here who is well versed in the research.
[02:26:06] ▶He could, perhaps provide some enlightenment on this.
[02:26:11] ▶Speaker 45: Evening, counselors. We did some work with Mental Health Research Canada last year where we did an up sample of about 4,000 BC residents.
[02:26:19] ▶And interestingly, the East Asian community was not identified,
[02:26:23] ▶with the problem gambling cohort. So the reason that we talk about indigenous communities and South Asian communities is the data is very clear that those particular communities do experience higher levels of harm.
[02:26:35] ▶For the East Asian community, it wasn't actually identified through the data, and so that's why it's not coming out in the report.
[02:26:42] ▶Speaker 7: That's right. And the data sources for that were?
[02:26:45] ▶Speaker 45: Mental Health Research Canada, which is a national organization that we partnered with. They did a sample of 4,000 BC residents about a year and a half ago.
[02:26:54] ▶And through that, they identified the the different categories. They looked at low risk, moderate risk, and high risk problem gambling behaviors. And what they found was in the East Asian community, it was a lot lower than we had expected it to be as well in that data collection. It was the South Asian community and the indigenous communities that identified as having higher levels of potential harm.
[02:27:13] ▶Speaker 7: And I'm I'm curious how how specific that sample size was to this this casino catchment area.
[02:27:20] ▶Obviously, you know, there was
[02:27:22] ▶different population dynamics, and I would anecdotally assume that South Asian
[02:27:27] ▶gamblers might be more attracted south of the freezer.
[02:27:31] ▶Speaker 45: Absolutely. I'll have to go back and look at the specific statistics around Lower Mainland and the East Asian community.
[02:27:38] ▶Speaker 7: Okay.
[02:27:41] ▶Are we is is there I I'm of the understanding that the gaming policy enforcement branch is putting together a report on gambling,
[02:27:49] ▶for later this spring and that there was a StatsCan
[02:27:52] ▶community health survey that was in the field, late late last year.
[02:27:57] ▶Have have those has the StatsCan study informed any of this, data?
[02:28:02] ▶Again, the question could be for for staff or the applicant.
[02:28:07] ▶Speaker 45: So in terms of the StatsCan report, it was the StatsCan did do the collection around the Canadian community health survey.
[02:28:13] ▶It was the first time in a number of years that they've done gambling. That data is not available as of yet. We've been checking, pretty pretty regularly to see when it will be available, and it looks like it's not going to be in probably until late summer, early next fall.
[02:28:26] ▶In terms of the other study that you mentioned from the gambling policy enforcement branch, They are working on a prevalent study for gambling in BC, and we're expecting those results to come out later this spring.
[02:28:38] ▶Speaker 7: K. So we're we're waiting on both those sets of of
[02:28:41] ▶sort of data points. Okay.
[02:28:43] ▶That's good for me. I I might jump back on, but I'm just gonna collect my notes for a second. Thanks. K. Thanks. Councilor Maloney.
[02:28:50] ▶Speaker 46: Thank you.
[02:28:52] ▶This one's for the applicant.
[02:28:54] ▶Can you explain the economic justification for expanding slot machines given the proliferation of online gambling?
[02:29:05] ▶Speaker 43: So
[02:29:06] ▶in terms of, what we hear from our players is, for land based gambling, which is what this application is primarily focused on, What they're looking for is expanded options,
[02:29:16] ▶different products,
[02:29:18] ▶different types of games. The online experience
[02:29:21] ▶does differ significantly.
[02:29:24] ▶There is some crossover, of course, between people that gamble in bricks and mortar land based facilities and and online.
[02:29:31] ▶But,
[02:29:32] ▶what we want to do is cater, of course, to all of the various,
[02:29:37] ▶player experiences that are being requested by our players.
[02:29:41] ▶Speaker 46: Okay.
[02:29:43] ▶Thanks.
[02:29:45] ▶What kind of can you explain more about the additional mitigation
[02:29:50] ▶measures that are proposed for this extension?
[02:29:54] ▶Speaker 43: Can you
[02:29:55] ▶Speaker 46: clarify for me? Well, you described,
[02:29:57] ▶how there are people that,
[02:30:00] ▶speak to,
[02:30:02] ▶gamblers
[02:30:03] ▶and that you can self register. But what what other types of mitigation measures are in place?
[02:30:10] ▶Speaker 43: So there's there's a variety of different, pieces that exist including, as I said, in our Game Sense program, there is dedicated space within the casino,
[02:30:18] ▶that provides education, different resources,
[02:30:22] ▶that's a variety of different, pamphlets, other pieces of information we offer also offered online. Those staff also go out into the casino, interact directly
[02:30:32] ▶with our players. They are trained,
[02:30:34] ▶in that particular,
[02:30:37] ▶behavioral area so that they can they can do that.
[02:30:40] ▶In terms of,
[02:30:41] ▶mitigations
[02:30:43] ▶broadly,
[02:30:44] ▶what we see here with this expansion is we continue to build on the platform and the programs,
[02:30:50] ▶that we built and and used very successfully across the entire province, including in other casinos that have a much higher, number of slot machines in them.
[02:31:00] ▶Speaker 46: Just from my experience in other other countries, do you have things like,
[02:31:05] ▶views to the outdoors and clocks and that kind of thing?
[02:31:09] ▶Speaker 43: Yes. So
[02:31:10] ▶we actually,
[02:31:12] ▶follow regulation that is set out by the gaming policy and enforcement branch, specifically around a number of those mitigations. So there are things like, you can't have,
[02:31:22] ▶direct view of,
[02:31:24] ▶bank machines on on the gaming floor as an example. You need to have clocks. You need to have some of those pieces. So those are all set out by the gaming policy enforcement branch, which we adhere to, of course.
[02:31:36] ▶Speaker 46: Okay.
[02:31:38] ▶The casino provides $300,000
[02:31:42] ▶annually to the social responsibility fund. Will the contribution
[02:31:46] ▶amount be increased in proportion to the increase in new machines?
[02:31:51] ▶Speaker 43: So,
[02:31:53] ▶the agreement,
[02:31:54] ▶in terms of the social responsibility fund, which is actually, I believe, a higher number than 300,000 in terms of what the what is currently provided,
[02:32:02] ▶has been as part of the review with city staff,
[02:32:06] ▶determined in terms of what what that, there will be an increase there. I can't speak to if it's proportional
[02:32:12] ▶exactly.
[02:32:13] ▶Speaker 46: Is there someone else that could answer that? Yep.
[02:32:17] ▶Speaker 44: Thank you. So we currently pay $600,000
[02:32:20] ▶into the social responsibility fund. That will be increased by an additional $300,000
[02:32:24] ▶a year.
[02:32:26] ▶Speaker 46: Thank you.
[02:32:28] ▶Speaker 8: Hey. Councilor Warr. Thanks. Yeah. Similar to the lines of questioning by councilor Maloney around,
[02:32:36] ▶demand. Is is there a demand?
[02:32:41] ▶Speaker 43: Thank you, councilor.
[02:32:42] ▶Yes. There very clearly is a demand. As we said, what we see is a lot of the players that actually reside in Vancouver
[02:32:50] ▶are leaving to go to other casinos because they're not,
[02:32:53] ▶getting the experience that they're wanting to see both in terms of availability and product types. So that's, really what is driving this application.
[02:33:02] ▶So what's the average wait time for a slot machine? How long do you have to line up for? Well, it it really depends on time of day and what else is going on. So as an example, right after a Canucks game, a concert, some other,
[02:33:14] ▶sort of,
[02:33:16] ▶large event downtown is going to differ quite drastically
[02:33:19] ▶from,
[02:33:20] ▶this evening as an example.
[02:33:23] ▶Speaker 8: What was the stat so you where did you get that stat from? You said something like 71% of gam gambling revenue,
[02:33:29] ▶from Vancouver residents alone? Correct.
[02:33:32] ▶Speaker 43: Yep. It was to somewhere else in the Lower Mainland? That's right. Where did you get that number? So that we have a variety of ways to be able to understand that data, and collect it. One of those is through our loyalty program. So our players play with us and they use their loyalty card. We're able to understand,
[02:33:48] ▶you know, where they reside.
[02:33:51] ▶Also, there is other additional survey and research data, that we rely on.
[02:33:57] ▶Speaker 8: Okay.
[02:33:58] ▶This is a question, again, I'll switch to staff.
[02:34:01] ▶I asked this, I think,
[02:34:05] ▶the other week, but can you just reiterate how this aligns with the Healthy City strategy that was just
[02:34:15] ▶Speaker 44: updated?
[02:34:17] ▶Speaker 42: Thank you for the question. So the Healthy City strategy is aligned around the social determinants of health for the city, and the sustainable development goals.
[02:34:27] ▶This,
[02:34:28] ▶as as we pointed out, there are both benefits and risks associated with the potential expansion of gaming.
[02:34:34] ▶So in aligning with the potential benefits, it could be viewed as having economic benefit.
[02:34:40] ▶In aligning with the potential risks,
[02:34:42] ▶looking at, risks to mental health, substance use,
[02:34:47] ▶health overall,
[02:34:49] ▶safety, and belonging. And so those are areas that are addressed in terms of other programmatic measures that are advanced through the Healthy City strategy. Okay. So it sounds like the, benefits are mostly financial and the risks are, social determinants
[02:35:02] ▶Speaker 8: of health.
[02:35:04] ▶I I I think somebody else asked around consultation as well.
[02:35:09] ▶I think, councilor Zhou did, but
[02:35:12] ▶do we have any sort of comparison of what that was like to the the 2011
[02:35:16] ▶sort of original?
[02:35:18] ▶Because I just seem to remember,
[02:35:19] ▶it being like an like, a more of a a, like, a town hall type situation rather than the the virtual meeting. Yeah. At that time,
[02:35:28] ▶Speaker 41: it was, because,
[02:35:29] ▶the actual casino was built. So it was, you know, a bit of broader the the whole casino was moving, whereas now we're seeing an existing,
[02:35:38] ▶facility, and
[02:35:40] ▶we chose not to do an in person
[02:35:43] ▶public hearing also because we didn't see a lot of submissions coming in.
[02:35:48] ▶We might have had done that had we seen more traffic. Okay.
[02:35:52] ▶Speaker 8: Why was the moratorium
[02:35:53] ▶put in place? Was it I assume it was this those sort of risk those the risks then?
[02:35:59] ▶Speaker 41: I wasn't around then, but I can ask my my colleagues from ACCS who also wasn't weren't around then, but they know better on the history of that.
[02:36:10] ▶Speaker 42: My understanding of the implementation of the moratorium
[02:36:14] ▶over a decade ago is that it also wanted to consider the health, social, and economic impacts of the risks of the introduction of gaming and gambling.
[02:36:22] ▶And so aligned with the Gaming Control Act in British Columbia,
[02:36:26] ▶the moratorium spoke to the fact that you would have to undertake broad scale consultation in order to contemplate an expansion of gaming or gambling. With council's reevaluation of that in 2024,
[02:36:35] ▶council continued a moratorium, but,
[02:36:39] ▶applications for expansion could be accompanied by an impact assessment.
[02:36:42] ▶Speaker 8: Okay. So the the comprehensive con consultation was wasn't needed with the amendment.
[02:36:48] ▶So we talked a little bit about some of the mitigation,
[02:36:52] ▶and risks. I don't have much time left. What about money laundering? I don't see that anywhere in here.
[02:37:01] ▶Speaker 42: In staff's assessment of the health impact assessment,
[02:37:04] ▶consultation was undertaken with Vancouver Police Department who considered,
[02:37:08] ▶the relative risks for that in associated with the 300 additional slot machines. It did not raise rate as a significant or high risk.
[02:37:17] ▶Speaker 8: Okay.
[02:37:20] ▶I'm trying to see here. I only have a few seconds left. That's it for me then. Thank you. Also okay. Councilor Maloney.
[02:37:28] ▶Speaker 46: Yeah. In terms of problem gamblers, wouldn't there be a certain element of harm mitigation from people having more restricted access to slot machines and having to make the effort to travel further afield to access?
[02:37:42] ▶Speaker 43: I think, again, the the
[02:37:44] ▶the reality of the market these days is if you have a mobile phone, you can gamble whenever and wherever you are seven days a week, twenty four hours a day. So restricting local, and physical access to swap machines,
[02:37:58] ▶doesn't really mitigate that. And in some cases, what it does is it pushes them
[02:38:03] ▶to,
[02:38:04] ▶illegal gambling auctions rather than expanded
[02:38:07] ▶legal and regulated gambling auctions, which allow us to put those safeguards and those protections in place,
[02:38:13] ▶around it.
[02:38:14] ▶Speaker 46: And, what are the opening hours of of the casino at the moment? And is that going to change?
[02:38:24] ▶Speaker 43: I understand it's currently twenty four seven,
[02:38:26] ▶and, there is no plan to change that currently.
[02:38:30] ▶Speaker 46: Okay. Thanks.
[02:38:32] ▶Speaker 1: Councilor Claassen. Yeah. Thanks. Just a quick question.
[02:38:36] ▶Good discussion, and thank you for the responses. The applicant, just with regards to the,
[02:38:40] ▶expansion that's being,
[02:38:42] ▶requested here, are there going to be an additional
[02:38:46] ▶kind of commensurate,
[02:38:48] ▶investments in staff training and or,
[02:38:52] ▶protection
[02:38:53] ▶player protection measures,
[02:38:55] ▶just given that there'd be more people there? And,
[02:39:01] ▶yeah. So I again, just reflecting, will there be increases to kind of measure the the the increase in number of people who will actually be using the the slots? Yeah. Yes. Absolutely.
[02:39:11] ▶Speaker 43: As was mentioned earlier, there will be an increase in staffing.
[02:39:14] ▶Part of it is we ensure that there's a certain coverage level. So there's sort of percentage,
[02:39:20] ▶based on that. So with an increase will come an increase in staff. Part of that, of course, will be all of the training that we do around appropriate response, player health,
[02:39:29] ▶player education resources, and and those sorts of pieces.
[02:39:33] ▶And again, we we are, ensuring that we're maintaining
[02:39:37] ▶all of our compliance with, what is set out in the regulation under the Gaming Control Act by JPAB, which includes,
[02:39:43] ▶a variety of pieces, not just player health, but also other security aspects like surveillance and etcetera. So those will,
[02:39:49] ▶Speaker 1: follow those rules and guidelines as well. Sure. Okay. And those were essentially that'll help us, continue the work of ID ing and and, responding to any problematic gambling that's, being seen there. Okay. Great. Thanks. Those are my questions. Thank you. So we're gonna take two minutes minutes recess so we can switch switch to the chair.
[02:41:18] ▶Speaker 33: And please call toll free +1 (833)
[02:41:21] ▶353-8610
[02:41:23] ▶followed by the participant code 1061445
[02:41:27] ▶before the close of the list. Phone number will be posted on x as well as displayed during the recess.
[02:41:33] ▶We are now gonna move to our public speakers. Any speakers in the council chamber, please come forward to the left podium, this one to my right, when it is your turn. Phone and speakers will be unmuted when it is your turn. Speakers will have up to five minutes to make their comments and should limit their comments to the merits of the application being considered. Our first registered speaker is from, public body representative list, Mark Liscisan, deputy chief medical health officer, Vancouver Coastal Health. Welcome back.
[02:42:01] ▶You have five minutes. I know you know the routine, so turn it over to you. Alright. Thank you. So, as you mentioned, I'm doctor Mark Lysysian,
[02:42:08] ▶Speaker 11: medical health officer for the city of Vancouver.
[02:42:11] ▶Under the BC Public Health Act. It requires medical health officers to advise local governments on public health issues.
[02:42:17] ▶Gambling is a significant public health issue associated with serious harms, things like suicide,
[02:42:24] ▶addiction,
[02:42:25] ▶family and relationship disruption, and severe financial issues like theft and bankruptcy.
[02:42:35] ▶Problem gambling
[02:42:36] ▶and addiction to gambling affects a a minority of the people who gamble. It's true.
[02:42:41] ▶But the harms are suffered,
[02:42:44] ▶you know, by that group,
[02:42:46] ▶although harms can be suffered by everyone.
[02:42:48] ▶Other vulnerable groups are also overrepresented in the harm, people with mental health issues, substance use disorders,
[02:42:55] ▶people with low socioeconomic status,
[02:42:57] ▶young adults.
[02:42:59] ▶And although
[02:43:00] ▶many kind of responsible gambling measures are implemented now in BC casinos,
[02:43:06] ▶the reality is that
[02:43:08] ▶the harms of gambling don't just affect the gambler.
[02:43:11] ▶Research shows that on average, about six people are affected for every one problem gambler that's affected by harms associated with gambling. So, you know, this affects gamblers' families, their children, their friends, their workplaces,
[02:43:24] ▶and their communities, not just the gamblers themselves.
[02:43:28] ▶So because of this,
[02:43:31] ▶gambling needs to be regulated.
[02:43:33] ▶And in a in a model where we regulate gambling, it needs to be legally available with as many protections as you can put in place, but you need to limit the availability,
[02:43:43] ▶so that, you know, the market doesn't just expand, expand, expand because then gambling activity expands and you see more harm.
[02:43:51] ▶So I spoke against the lifting of the moratorium.
[02:43:55] ▶I participated in the health impact assessment process,
[02:43:58] ▶and I'm here to speak in in opposition to,
[02:44:02] ▶the motion tonight.
[02:44:03] ▶The health impact assessment process,
[02:44:06] ▶was very good at identifying the potential benefits,
[02:44:09] ▶that would come for this. We got
[02:44:11] ▶exact numbers on how much, expected revenue might come in and how that would benefit the city of Vancouver
[02:44:17] ▶and other, community agencies.
[02:44:20] ▶But,
[02:44:21] ▶we weren't able to identify specific numbers for the amount of harms that are coming from this facility currently.
[02:44:28] ▶Park couldn't provide them. BCLC couldn't provide them. And the province really hasn't done,
[02:44:33] ▶any kind of significant
[02:44:34] ▶look at the harms associated with gambling in BC
[02:44:38] ▶since the 2009
[02:44:39] ▶provincial health officer
[02:44:41] ▶report.
[02:44:42] ▶So there's not really a great accounting
[02:44:44] ▶of the harms associated with gambling even though there is a great,
[02:44:49] ▶accounting of the benefits.
[02:44:51] ▶And we've heard a lot today about the player protections and some of the mitigation men measures, and we're happy to have these in place. But at the same time, park and BCLC could not provide us with any data about the effectiveness of these measures. How many suicides do these prevent?
[02:45:07] ▶How many cases of problem gambling do these prevent?
[02:45:10] ▶There's no data on that.
[02:45:14] ▶So, you know, this is a high risk activity.
[02:45:17] ▶We have availability in Vancouver. We have availability
[02:45:20] ▶in the Lower Mainland.
[02:45:22] ▶And,
[02:45:23] ▶you know, we don't believe that further availability
[02:45:26] ▶is necessary. If there's more gambling activity that takes place at this facility, it increases the likelihood of problem gambling. It increases the likelihood of harms.
[02:45:36] ▶If this,
[02:45:39] ▶motion does go forward, we we do encourage you, to to kind of,
[02:45:44] ▶accept the increase in the social responsibility fund and the responsible gaming
[02:45:49] ▶agreement. We participated in those discussions about the updated agreement.
[02:45:53] ▶The current agreement clearly has not
[02:45:56] ▶been able to,
[02:45:59] ▶kind of
[02:46:00] ▶monitor or,
[02:46:01] ▶characterize the exact harms coming from this facility, and that made it difficult to characterize what additional harms will come from this expansion. So we're hoping that with this new agreement, there'll be more attention on that and that if, you know, future expansions are proposed, we'll at least have some data about the current harms that are coming from this facility
[02:46:19] ▶and, any proposed expansion. So, again,
[02:46:23] ▶we're recommending you vote in in opposition to this. Thank you.
[02:46:27] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you for your remarks this evening.
[02:46:29] ▶We'll move to our regular speakers list. Our first speaker, number one has withdrawn. Our second speaker is Sandra Garcino
[02:46:36] ▶in person. Welcome, Sandra.
[02:46:39] ▶And you have up to five minutes to address counsel.
[02:46:46] ▶Speaker 47: Thank you very much, and thank you all for your hard work and your attention.
[02:46:51] ▶I would think that the primary rationale for this application is increased revenues to the city
[02:46:57] ▶and the suggestion
[02:46:59] ▶that this is there is some kind of unmet need for more gambling,
[02:47:04] ▶facilities in at Park Casino.
[02:47:06] ▶The historical pattern here is actually very clear if you look at it, which is overstated projections,
[02:47:13] ▶under forming underperforming reality, and declining revenues.
[02:47:17] ▶In 2004,
[02:47:18] ▶when slot machines were first proposed,
[02:47:21] ▶to this city council, the lottery corporation projected $10 to $12,000,000
[02:47:26] ▶in annual revenue to the city.
[02:47:28] ▶And, and that was at the original Edgewater location.
[02:47:32] ▶The casino actually averaged about $6,200,000
[02:47:36] ▶per year in the first
[02:47:37] ▶years. That's not a minor gap and that's not a one off. In 2010,
[02:47:43] ▶the BC Lottery Corporation
[02:47:45] ▶projected an expanded casino would generate $17,300,000
[02:47:49] ▶annually for the city.
[02:47:51] ▶What was not disclosed at that time was that the Lottery Corporation had commissioned an independent hospitality expert report from HLT advisory
[02:47:59] ▶and that that analysis
[02:48:01] ▶sharply can contradicted,
[02:48:03] ▶the representations
[02:48:04] ▶that were made by Little Autry Corporation to this body and to the public. And the HLT advisory projected revenues of approximately
[02:48:13] ▶$9,800,000.
[02:48:14] ▶And that report only came to light when it was published on Francis Buellis,
[02:48:19] ▶blog.
[02:48:21] ▶It ran about 20 pages, was very detailed,
[02:48:23] ▶and was worth a look. You can't find it anymore now. I can't find it, but I did see it at the time.
[02:48:30] ▶We're being told today that there's a great need and a great demand
[02:48:34] ▶for more gambling facilities at the park.
[02:48:38] ▶And yet,
[02:48:39] ▶the reality is that just over construction of the new park casino,
[02:48:44] ▶revenues to the city ran and averaged about 8,300,000,
[02:48:48] ▶topping at about 9,430,000
[02:48:51] ▶in 2018.
[02:48:54] ▶The number today is 6,100,000,
[02:48:58] ▶roughly the same as it was in 2005,
[02:49:01] ▶2006
[02:49:02] ▶with this exception.
[02:49:03] ▶In today's dollars,
[02:49:05] ▶that 2,005,
[02:49:06] ▶2,006 of 6,200,000,
[02:49:10] ▶this would be a a 36%
[02:49:13] ▶drop from the 2000,
[02:49:15] ▶5, 2006.
[02:49:16] ▶We would
[02:49:19] ▶be getting considerably more if we were just staying even. But we're not. Right now, the revenue is about $6,100,000
[02:49:28] ▶Down 35%
[02:49:30] ▶from its high in 2018.
[02:49:32] ▶So how can it be said, and this has been a persistent pattern over a number of years, so how can it be said that,
[02:49:40] ▶there's need for more,
[02:49:42] ▶facilities
[02:49:43] ▶at the Park Casino? In fact, it's underperforming.
[02:49:48] ▶35%
[02:49:49] ▶below capacity.
[02:49:51] ▶This is not a business experiencing excess demand that requires expansion.
[02:49:56] ▶Even accounting for population growth.
[02:49:59] ▶And we can't even really see what park casino estimates the increased revenue to the city to be.
[02:50:05] ▶The BC Lottery Corporation's own annual reports show casino visits are declining. This is not just local. Land based casinos across North America are under structural pressure from online gambling, shifting player behavior, and higher operating costs
[02:50:20] ▶compared to digital
[02:50:22] ▶competitors. Great Canadian,
[02:50:24] ▶gaming is divesting most of its BC assets.
[02:50:28] ▶In Nevada,
[02:50:29] ▶some 307,
[02:50:31] ▶casinos have seen a combined income
[02:50:33] ▶fall of 24%
[02:50:35] ▶in 2024.
[02:50:37] ▶That's before Donald Trump's tariffs.
[02:50:40] ▶Every it's well known that the strip is really suffering.
[02:50:43] ▶So the industry response and this is not just happening with the BC Lottery Corporation and partners. You know, the industry response
[02:50:50] ▶across the industry has been to increase electronic gaming slot machines
[02:50:54] ▶and electronic tables, which generate
[02:50:56] ▶higher revenue, but with lower labor and operating costs.
[02:51:00] ▶But these are widely recognized as the most addictive forms of gambling. Just just go ask GPT.
[02:51:08] ▶Just just go ask chat GPT right now what is the most addictive form of gambling. And even more than sports betting, which we're all starting to become very concerned about,
[02:51:19] ▶our slot machines.
[02:51:21] ▶And the this city has been struggling with addiction and the weight of that addiction.
[02:51:26] ▶What I would suggest that this, city needs or what what you need is independent revenue projections,
[02:51:33] ▶comprehensive
[02:51:33] ▶business model focusing, forecasting,
[02:51:36] ▶and independent addiction expertise such as, the,
[02:51:41] ▶medical health officer of Vancouver.
[02:51:44] ▶Thank you for your time. I wish I could have more.
[02:51:48] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, Sandra. Thank you for those comments and that information.
[02:51:51] ▶We're gonna move to our next speaker,
[02:51:53] ▶number three on the phone, Aman.
[02:51:57] ▶Aman?
[02:51:58] ▶Yes. Yes. Hello? One second. Hi, Aman. You your address is also you have up to five minutes.
[02:52:03] ▶Speaker 19: Hi.
[02:52:05] ▶Speaker 25: One second here. Thank you for allowing me to talk today.
[02:52:09] ▶My name is Amin Broer, and I'm here today as a resident of Vancouver.
[02:52:14] ▶I want to speak to the discussion around adding more slot machines at Park Casino.
[02:52:19] ▶With respect, I think we're asking the wrong question.
[02:52:22] ▶Today,
[02:52:23] ▶anyone with a smartphone already has a casino in their pocket.
[02:52:26] ▶Online gambling is widely accessible through platforms like Bet three six five, PokerStars,
[02:52:32] ▶Vet GM MGM,
[02:52:34] ▶and availability is not the issue.
[02:52:36] ▶We're
[02:52:37] ▶really talking about
[02:52:39] ▶in whether Vancouver residents can enjoy a regulated in person entertainment experience in their own city.
[02:52:46] ▶Right now, Downtown Vancouver has essentially one major option, Park Vancouver,
[02:52:51] ▶and often there are no available slots.
[02:52:53] ▶After a hockey game at Rogers Arena, when thousand people pour into the streets looking for something to do, options are limited.
[02:53:00] ▶If you want a reliable in person experience, you're often told to go to Burnaby.
[02:53:05] ▶Why should residents here leave Vancouver to enjoy entertainment?
[02:53:08] ▶Adding 300 or more slot machines won't suddenly increase gambling in a world where gambling is readily available twenty four seven off your smartphone.
[02:53:17] ▶What it will do is help meet existing demand in a controlled, regulated, in person environment downtown.
[02:53:23] ▶This isn't about expanding gambling culture. It's about supporting downtown vibrancy, keeping entertainment dollars in Vancouver, and giving residents
[02:53:31] ▶options in their own city. If council is concerned about farm reduction, I would argue that a supervised regulated facility,
[02:53:39] ▶physical venue is far more accountable
[02:53:42] ▶than the digital alternative that already exists.
[02:53:45] ▶Vancouver should be a city where people can work, live, attend a game, have dinner, and enjoy entertainment,
[02:53:50] ▶all without
[02:53:51] ▶needing to cross city boundaries. Thank you for your time.
[02:53:55] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much for your comments. Our next speaker is speaker number four, Paul Sangara, also on the phone. Go ahead, Paul.
[02:54:03] ▶Speaker 19: Good evening, mayor and council. My name is Paul Sangara. I'm a resident of East Vancouver.
[02:54:09] ▶And, just while I was waiting,
[02:54:12] ▶listening to everyone,
[02:54:13] ▶speak over the phone,
[02:54:15] ▶I did notice that, a lot of people were bringing up the online Bet three six five,
[02:54:21] ▶PokerStars, DraftKings, all of that.
[02:54:24] ▶And I would like to,
[02:54:26] ▶pretty much follow-up on that because,
[02:54:29] ▶that's something that doesn't require you to travel. I mean, you don't have to walk into a physical building. You don't gotta interact with anyone.
[02:54:37] ▶And this is just becoming the reality of gambling, not only in Vancouver, just worldwide.
[02:54:42] ▶So when we're, debating here about adding 300 slot machines
[02:54:47] ▶and giving more access in gambling, we're pretty much debating something that already
[02:54:53] ▶exists and has existed
[02:54:55] ▶for
[02:54:57] ▶pretty much a long time.
[02:54:59] ▶The question in front of you is not whether gambling will occur. It already does. The real question is is whether Vancouver will provide regulated
[02:55:08] ▶in person entertainment experiences in its own downtown core, or is it gonna continue pushing activity
[02:55:15] ▶towards more
[02:55:17] ▶of the online books
[02:55:18] ▶the online sportsbooks?
[02:55:22] ▶Obviously, we live in Vancouver. We host, NHL games at Rogers Arenas along with other
[02:55:28] ▶concerts and various
[02:55:30] ▶events. Thousands of people come out,
[02:55:33] ▶pour out onto the streets
[02:55:35] ▶after a game like that,
[02:55:37] ▶and they don't really have anywhere to go other than clubs, bars, or casinos.
[02:55:42] ▶Yeah. We only have one casino, which is Park, and it's pretty much like everyone's saying it operates at
[02:55:49] ▶capacity.
[02:55:52] ▶I think that, it wouldn't be an excess
[02:55:55] ▶bringing in 300 more slot machines. I think it would just be meeting the demand.
[02:55:59] ▶If council's concern is harm reduction,
[02:56:02] ▶then we should recognize that a staff who provides regulated physical venues
[02:56:07] ▶offers much more accountability and security
[02:56:10] ▶than a app that follows people into their homes, and it will sometimes never close.
[02:56:15] ▶300 additional machines is not gonna create a gambling problem.
[02:56:20] ▶It's already here. I just demonstrated that.
[02:56:23] ▶What it will do is allow Vancouver to manage it locally, keep economic activity downtown,
[02:56:29] ▶and support vibrancy in a controlled setting.
[02:56:32] ▶We cannot pretend we're limiting something if this is already existing in everyone's pockets, everyone's living room.
[02:56:39] ▶And in my opinion, just honest opinion, I think it's a lot safer
[02:56:44] ▶to actually have to go physically into a building and gamble than to just be sitting on your bed going through money all day, not even taking into account the value of real money,
[02:56:55] ▶which is what the the newer generations are sort of coming accustomed to, which is what we need to kinda stop.
[02:57:03] ▶And,
[02:57:04] ▶Speaker 33: that's about it. I wanna thank you guys for your time. Have a good evening. Thank you very much for calling in this evening. Our next speaker is speaker number five, Ian Pitfield, here in person.
[02:57:14] ▶Welcome, Ian.
[02:57:17] ▶Speaker 48: Thank you, madam chair and councilors.
[02:57:21] ▶My name is Ian Pitfield. I'm a resident of Vancouver,
[02:57:25] ▶in Yaletown.
[02:57:27] ▶I've been opposed to the development of the Park Casino since
[02:57:31] ▶the idea first came to me or I first learned about it back in 2011.
[02:57:37] ▶It's been a constant battle ever since to try to constrain,
[02:57:41] ▶if not defeat,
[02:57:43] ▶what's going on down there at the Park Casino.
[02:57:47] ▶I urge you to defeat
[02:57:49] ▶this resolution
[02:57:51] ▶and,
[02:57:52] ▶that would result in the increase in the number of slots from 600 to 900.
[02:57:56] ▶And in that regard, I wholeheartedly endorse the remarks that were made by, miss Gerasino.
[02:58:03] ▶If you are thinking of approving
[02:58:06] ▶the application as it's presented,
[02:58:08] ▶I would urge you to defer the vote.
[02:58:12] ▶There's a very good reason to defer.
[02:58:15] ▶Back in 2014,
[02:58:18] ▶the government or one of its departments or agencies
[02:58:21] ▶commissioned a report entitled
[02:58:23] ▶BC problem gambling gambling
[02:58:25] ▶prevalence study.
[02:58:27] ▶The study followed with a further study in 2020
[02:58:31] ▶prepared for the provincial government
[02:58:33] ▶and the gaming enforcement branch.
[02:58:37] ▶A new study is now being undertaken.
[02:58:40] ▶I think, one of the counselors mentioned that earlier in this discussion this today.
[02:58:45] ▶Reportedly by the Department of Public Safety and the solicitor general, it's intended to update the conclusions
[02:58:52] ▶expressed in the 2014
[02:58:54] ▶and 2020
[02:58:55] ▶reports,
[02:58:56] ▶namely that gaming problems produce financial harm,
[02:59:00] ▶mental issues in the form of anxiety and depression,
[02:59:04] ▶suicidal ideation,
[02:59:06] ▶and suicidal planning, and unfortunately, sometimes suicide itself.
[02:59:11] ▶The data for the present study
[02:59:15] ▶has been compiled as I understand it, and there is a likelihood that the report will be finalized
[02:59:20] ▶this spring.
[02:59:22] ▶There's every reason to believe that the report will conclude
[02:59:26] ▶that the incidence of problem and addicted gambling
[02:59:30] ▶has increased since 2014.
[02:59:33] ▶A startling increase
[02:59:35] ▶in problem and addictive gambling
[02:59:37] ▶was portrayed in material circulated by the Mental Health Research Canada
[02:59:41] ▶as recently as November
[02:59:43] ▶2025.
[02:59:45] ▶As I recall, the
[02:59:48] ▶the estimate of the population
[02:59:50] ▶involved in problem and addictive gaming back in 2014,
[02:59:54] ▶2020
[02:59:55] ▶was about three percent of the gaming population.
[02:59:59] ▶The most recent
[03:00:01] ▶information
[03:00:01] ▶that was, distributed by the mental health research,
[03:00:06] ▶Canada indicated that the number had increased from about three percent to about nine percent.
[03:00:12] ▶I would expect that I'm sure
[03:00:15] ▶that,
[03:00:16] ▶BC Lottery Corporation
[03:00:18] ▶and probably Park has participated
[03:00:21] ▶and responded to questions that must have been asked by them by the authors of the report and the investigators
[03:00:28] ▶who are doing the work.
[03:00:31] ▶One should
[03:00:32] ▶fully expect
[03:00:34] ▶that the proliferation of online gambling
[03:00:38] ▶is going to detract from
[03:00:40] ▶the need for additional slot machines in park and probably
[03:00:44] ▶detract from the need for a facility like park at all,
[03:00:49] ▶because all of the forms of camping that you can engage in in in a casino
[03:00:55] ▶are equally available
[03:00:56] ▶by phone.
[03:00:59] ▶So
[03:01:00] ▶in response to the to the resolution, I would say I would encourage you to act in a responsible
[03:01:07] ▶way
[03:01:08] ▶as counsel
[03:01:10] ▶with eyes on the welfare of our city's population
[03:01:13] ▶at large.
[03:01:15] ▶I encourage you to at least wait until we have the updated report
[03:01:20] ▶finalized and the results are known.
[03:01:23] ▶Certainly, what
[03:01:25] ▶what BC Lottery Corporation has portrayed is that
[03:01:29] ▶it represents the platinum or gold standard
[03:01:32] ▶of casino operation
[03:01:34] ▶in our country and indeed throughout the world.
[03:01:37] ▶I'm sure that if their practices and procedures and their
[03:01:42] ▶their diminution, if you like, of problem and addictive gambling
[03:01:46] ▶are as good as they say they are, that will probably be evident in the report that's going to be,
[03:01:53] ▶released later this spring.
[03:01:55] ▶I ask you a simple question. Why would you want to act precipitously
[03:02:00] ▶when you have the likelihood
[03:02:02] ▶of a well informed
[03:02:05] ▶and
[03:02:06] ▶studied,
[03:02:07] ▶report coming forward
[03:02:09] ▶sometime between now and in the next few months.
[03:02:13] ▶The best course
[03:02:15] ▶in my
[03:02:16] ▶I would submit is to require city staff to direct inquiries to the gaming and enforcement branch and the department of public safety and the solicitor general to get specifics
[03:02:27] ▶of the of the, regarding the timing of the finalization release of the nearly complete report and any indication of the trends that it will, convey.
[03:02:36] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, Ian. That's your time. Thank you. Appreciate your comments. Thank you.
[03:02:41] ▶Our next speaker, speaker number six, George Chaika,
[03:02:45] ▶in person.
[03:02:47] ▶Good evening.
[03:02:54] ▶Speaker 49: Good evening, madam chair and council. My name is George Chaika. I'm the senior vice president of business for the BC Lions Football Club,
[03:03:02] ▶and I'm here tonight to support BC Lottery Corporation and Park Casino
[03:03:07] ▶in their request for expansion.
[03:03:09] ▶For more than twenty years, we've teamed up with BCLC,
[03:03:13] ▶and it's always been more than just about football or gaming.
[03:03:17] ▶It's about making Vancouver and British Columbia
[03:03:20] ▶a better place for everyone.
[03:03:22] ▶BC Lottery Corporation and Park Casino do so much for our community.
[03:03:28] ▶BCLC's
[03:03:29] ▶BCLC community heroes program celebrates folks and groups
[03:03:33] ▶who really make a difference inspiring others to get involved, and that's something that we recognize before each of our home games at BC Play Stadium.
[03:03:43] ▶They've also supported our be more than a bystander program,
[03:03:46] ▶which is all about respect, inclusion,
[03:03:49] ▶and stopping gender based violence,
[03:03:52] ▶something both Alliance and BC Lottery Corporation are very proud to stand for.
[03:03:57] ▶And in 2024,
[03:03:59] ▶ECLC's
[03:04:00] ▶support was a huge part of making the Grey Cup in Vancouver such an outstanding success,
[03:04:06] ▶not just the game, but the events surrounding it, including the Grey Cup Festival.
[03:04:12] ▶Their involvement helped make the event bigger and better, bringing together people from all over the country
[03:04:18] ▶and showing off just how spectacular
[03:04:21] ▶Vancouver can be when it comes to hosting major sporting events.
[03:04:26] ▶The festival atmosphere,
[03:04:27] ▶the energy,
[03:04:29] ▶and the celebrations really showcased our city to fans coast to coast and gave local businesses a tremendous boost to the tune of $88,000,000
[03:04:38] ▶that was spent here in Vancouver.
[03:04:41] ▶And the Grey Cup Festival in 2024
[03:04:44] ▶being named the national sporting event by the Sport Tourism Association of Canada for any sporting event with a budget of over $3,000,000.
[03:04:53] ▶Working together for over two decades, we've seen firsthand how much gets done when organizations
[03:05:00] ▶care about the community.
[03:05:02] ▶Whether it's in the stands at our games,
[03:05:05] ▶through these great programs, or at big events like the Grey Cup, the city genuinely benefits from what BCLC
[03:05:12] ▶brings to the table.
[03:05:14] ▶And Park Casino isn't just a place to play games.
[03:05:18] ▶It's a hot spot in Downtown Vancouver for world class entertainment and big sporting events.
[03:05:24] ▶It draws visitors,
[03:05:26] ▶boosts local businesses, and gives our city a chance to shine globally.
[03:05:31] ▶With this expansion, Park can host even more unforgettable events,
[03:05:35] ▶create jobs, and help the economy thrive for everyone here.
[03:05:40] ▶Park also adds to Alliance game day experience through pre and post game entertainment
[03:05:45] ▶experiences, and I've seen firsthand
[03:05:47] ▶the the the lineups, the busyness that park casino experiences before and after our games.
[03:05:54] ▶BC Lions, Park Casino, and BC Lottery Corporation
[03:05:58] ▶all wanna see Vancouver grow,
[03:06:00] ▶be inclusive,
[03:06:01] ▶and succeed.
[03:06:03] ▶Responsible gaming
[03:06:05] ▶and strong community values go hand in hand.
[03:06:08] ▶So we're asking council to support the applications
[03:06:12] ▶and help us keep Vancouver moving forward.
[03:06:15] ▶Thank you for your consideration,
[03:06:17] ▶and we hope you allow the expansion for Park Casino.
[03:06:20] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, George. Thanks for coming in this evening.
[03:06:24] ▶Speaker number seven, Lindsay Brown.
[03:06:27] ▶Is Lindsay here?
[03:06:30] ▶Oh, I think she might be popping in right now. Yeah.
[03:06:35] ▶Welcome, Lindsay. You're gonna be going to this podium over here to
[03:06:39] ▶yeah. Your left, my right. Yeah.
[03:06:45] ▶Speaker 50: Mayor and council.
[03:06:47] ▶My name is Lindsey Brown. I'm a cofounder of Vancouver Not Vegas, which was the grassroots organization that defeated the last attempt at expanding this casino back in 2011
[03:06:57] ▶when it was called the Edgewater Casino.
[03:06:59] ▶And, unsurprisingly, I am still opposed to the expansion.
[03:07:03] ▶There's too much critical information omitted from this application.
[03:07:07] ▶It is not ready for counsel, and any decision should be delayed until counsel has sufficient information.
[03:07:14] ▶You've all received, I think, the letter I co signed with Michelle Travis of Unite Here Local forty.
[03:07:19] ▶It's a comprehensive letter and five minutes isn't enough time to cover all of its points. So I would ask you to please read it before voting if you haven't already.
[03:07:27] ▶And tonight I'd just like to bring up some, other information from the prior fight that seems germane to this one.
[03:07:34] ▶First, I just need to say I can't believe I have to come back here and fight this again.
[03:07:40] ▶An issue that I and hundreds of others fought fifteen years ago. And to add insult to injury, today is the fifteenth anniversary of the beginning of those hearings.
[03:07:49] ▶It was 02/17/2011.
[03:07:51] ▶And instead of celebrating that win, we have to come back here and do Groundhog Day all over again.
[03:07:57] ▶Former B. C. Supreme Court Judge Ian Pitfield, who just spoke before me, helped us defeat that expansion, and I always remember him standing on this exact spot in 2011 and saying to mayor and council, don't make me come back here, you guys.
[03:08:09] ▶I hoped you wouldn't have to and yet here we are.
[03:08:13] ▶As an aside, I also want to remind this Council that those hearings set a record for speaker numbers which was only broken years later by the 105 Keefer debate.
[03:08:22] ▶Gambling expansion tends to be deeply unpopular in BC but especially in Vancouver. Those hearings went on for weeks with the vast majority of speakers opposed and given that gambling problems,
[03:08:33] ▶tragic as we all know they are, hit nearly every
[03:08:36] ▶extended family in BC.
[03:08:40] ▶So it's unsurprising
[03:08:41] ▶that so many were opposed.
[03:08:43] ▶In 2011, multiple reputable polls bore this out and it showed a staggering majority of Vancouverites
[03:08:49] ▶strongly opposed
[03:08:51] ▶and
[03:08:53] ▶they also felt that the benefits of casinos were outweighed by the harms of financial losses, violence, and addiction
[03:08:59] ▶with slots considered the most highly addictive.
[03:09:02] ▶Economic data supported those views, the policing costs, the social and financial costs
[03:09:07] ▶generally shown to be commute cumulatively higher than the revenues for the public. And you can find all of that information on the website for that fight, which we kept alive. It's Vancouver not vegas.ca.
[03:09:17] ▶And we kept it alive against an eventuality
[03:09:19] ▶just like this.
[03:09:21] ▶For what it's worth, in my decades of activism, I have never seen that much cross partisan consensus in public opinion,
[03:09:29] ▶and I don't think things have changed.
[03:09:31] ▶Even though we now have a more impoverished media environment, it was very interesting to see last night's Vancouver Sun article by Joanne Lee Young on Parks' application
[03:09:38] ▶get a flood of online comments from across the political spectrum all negative.
[03:09:43] ▶Apropos of nothing, another parallel with 2011 is that we were heading for a civic election in the fall then too.
[03:09:51] ▶But I guess my main question for council today is what is the rush here?
[03:09:55] ▶Why is this application being pushed through so quickly with so little information offered to council including
[03:10:01] ▶there's no clear ident
[03:10:03] ▶idea of the contributions to the city
[03:10:05] ▶And with so little public notice,
[03:10:07] ▶is it fear of Vancouverites organizing again or is it that BCLC and the proponent are attempting to get this expansion pushed past council before a number of new expected studies on gambling addiction and revenues are released this spring and fall?
[03:10:21] ▶True or not, the rumour is parks owners want to sell the casino.
[03:10:25] ▶So the optics are that this is a real estate play in a hurry.
[03:10:29] ▶We need to be assured that's not what this is about.
[03:10:33] ▶Is the financially imperiled park trying to sweeten the pot for buyers with an enticement of more slots?
[03:10:38] ▶In the context of a sale, new negative reports about slots and addictions and failing revenues would be inconvenient.
[03:10:44] ▶The fact is, as you've heard already, most of these brick and mortar casinos are failing or beginning to fail, not just Park, and Park has been in deep financial trouble ever since it opened in 2017.
[03:10:55] ▶Interestingly, revenues from slots, the area of these casinos that most target low income and vulnerable gamblers are actually way down, as you've heard, possibly due to online gaming.
[03:11:05] ▶The proponent is arguing that Vancouver's population has increased, so slots must too. But if use of slots is pegged to population, why are demand for slots
[03:11:13] ▶and subsequently the revenues down?
[03:11:15] ▶I would like to see the data showing Vancouverites are leaving the city for suburban casinos.
[03:11:20] ▶The likelier explanation is the explosion of online gaming.
[03:11:24] ▶A few last points,
[03:11:26] ▶Arts and charities. The proponents always trot out benefit starts in charities, but those promises never deliver and charities are traditionally dinged out of money that they would be getting.
[03:11:36] ▶And see, I'm about to run out of time, so I'll just,
[03:11:40] ▶in short, ask you to please take more time to decide whether a reckless addition of another full casino's worth of slots to this city without a rationale that makes sense is a good idea.
[03:11:50] ▶A decision on this application should be delayed until upcoming gambling studies are publicly released.
[03:11:55] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, Lindsay. Please vote no. Thank you very much. It's your time. Thank you. Appreciate that.
[03:12:01] ▶Our next speaker is speaker number eight, Michelle Travis.
[03:12:06] ▶Just give Michelle a moment to come in.
[03:12:14] ▶Speaker 20: Welcome, Michelle.
[03:12:17] ▶Speaker 51: Good evening.
[03:12:18] ▶My name is Michelle Travis, and I live in Vancouver. I am here on behalf of Unite Here Local forty.
[03:12:24] ▶We oppose this proposal. It raises two key questions. Will community benefits outweigh the costs of adding 300 more slots? And can park generate the level of host city revenues that they promise?
[03:12:36] ▶For both questions, we believe the answer is no.
[03:12:39] ▶Worse, if council approves this proposal, we are concerned this could be another giveaway that short changes Vancouver residents.
[03:12:46] ▶This is not a minor zoning amendment. Adding 300 more slots is the equivalent of adding another casino downtown.
[03:12:52] ▶Over a decade ago, residents fought for and won a moratorium on gambling expansion, limiting tables and slots at two existing casinos and prohibiting new ones.
[03:13:01] ▶Approving this undermines that public safeguard and defies the will of the people and who really benefits.
[03:13:07] ▶Park has shifted its customer focus to a gambler and casino first strategy.
[03:13:12] ▶Park's VP of marketing has stated that growth will come from casino players, not casual visitors.
[03:13:18] ▶That suggests a focus on frequent gamblers, which may include the very people most at risk of problem gambling.
[03:13:25] ▶Roughly 5% of problem gamblers generate about one third of gambling revenues in BC,
[03:13:30] ▶and slot machines are among the most addictive forms of gambling.
[03:13:33] ▶The city estimates 6,000 additional patrons could face varying levels of risk for problem gambling if more slots are allowed, harm that extends to families and communities.
[03:13:43] ▶Problem gambling is rising among people earning under 40,000 a year and those aged 65 and older.
[03:13:49] ▶If park doubles down on core gamblers, this may increase pressure on our stretched health and social services.
[03:13:55] ▶The costs of emergency response is also a concern.
[03:14:00] ▶Data from the Vancouver Police and Fire Departments
[03:14:03] ▶show that emergency calls tend to rise and fall in tandem with parks revenues.
[03:14:08] ▶Between 2020 and 2024,
[03:14:10] ▶there were a total of 1,439
[03:14:12] ▶police and fire calls to 39 Smythe Street. That's a level level comparable to or exceeds calls to certain SROs on Granville Street that house some of our city's most vulnerable residents.
[03:14:24] ▶But then again,
[03:14:25] ▶city leaders have cited emergency call volumes at SROs to justify closing them on Granville Street. The council is considering a major gambling expansion
[03:14:34] ▶that generates a similar number of emergency calls without the same level of scrutiny.
[03:14:39] ▶So what community benefits offset these social costs?
[03:14:43] ▶ARC is proposing a $150,000
[03:14:46] ▶top up to the city's social responsibility
[03:14:48] ▶fund in 2027
[03:14:51] ▶and again in 2028 with inflation inflation adjusted increases thereafter.
[03:14:57] ▶Yet Park already owes $400,000
[03:14:59] ▶in inflation adjusted increases to the city's social responsibility fund under its community benefits agreement.
[03:15:06] ▶We're wondering how many years has Park not been in compliance with this community benefits agreement.
[03:15:11] ▶Given the auditor general's concerns, the city hall has not maximized the value of public land sales or collected the full value of community amenity contributions owed by developers.
[03:15:20] ▶How can we be confident that park will be held accountable?
[03:15:24] ▶Then there's a question of whether 300 more slots can generate the host city revenues promised to Vancouver.
[03:15:30] ▶The applicant argues more slots are needed because Vancouver's population has grown 22% since 2011,
[03:15:36] ▶while the number of slots have remained the same.
[03:15:38] ▶They seem to suggest there is so much pent up demand for slot machines that park can't keep up.
[03:15:44] ▶What they emit is that park slot revenues have declined by 19% since fiscal year twenty eighteen, twenty nineteen.
[03:15:50] ▶That's the steepest drop among comparable casinos around Metro Vancouver.
[03:15:54] ▶The BC Lottery Corporation warns the casino market is facing saturation in their annual reports with an aging customer base and increased competition from online gaming.
[03:16:04] ▶Adding 300 slots will further cannibalize the Metropolitan
[03:16:07] ▶Vancouver,
[03:16:08] ▶casino market.
[03:16:10] ▶And many Vancouverites live closer to Hastings Casino, the other Vancouver casino,
[03:16:15] ▶Grandville Villa, and River Rock, than Park, and adding slots won't change that.
[03:16:20] ▶Claims that Park will generate an additional 1,000,000 in new host city revenues should be treated with caution. Similar projections at area casinos have fallen short of expectations.
[03:16:32] ▶Even if those revenues materialize,
[03:16:34] ▶parks proposed community benefit is a mere drop in the bucket relative to the social costs.
[03:16:39] ▶An independent revenue assessment of what the city can realistically expect is warranted here.
[03:16:44] ▶Finally, counsel should ask the applicant where the new slot machines would be sourced.
[03:16:48] ▶The BC Lottery Corporation partners with IGT, which manufactures many of its slots in The United States. IGT is owned by a US private equity firm whose CEO is a big backer of the Trump administration.
[03:17:00] ▶So at a time when British Columbia and Canada face punishing tariffs from The US, this is not the time to go team USA.
[03:17:06] ▶We respectfully urge you to reject this proposal.
[03:17:10] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you. Thanks very much for your comments this evening.
[03:17:13] ▶Our next speaker is speaker number nine, Colleen Hardwick, by phone.
[03:17:19] ▶Good evening, Colleen.
[03:17:23] ▶Speaker 1: Speaker number nine is not on the line.
[03:17:26] ▶Speaker 33: Our next speaker after that is speaker 10, Stanley Lee.
[03:17:30] ▶Speaker 2: We have Stanley. Can you hear me? Can you hear me even though I'm on a speakerphone?
[03:17:35] ▶Speaker 33: Yes. We can hear you. Go ahead.
[03:17:38] ▶Speaker 2: Okay. I think I'm coming across clearer over the speakerphone rather than my problematic phone, so here it goes.
[03:17:46] ▶Good evening, counsel.
[03:17:48] ▶I my name is Stanley, currently still living in Vancouver.
[03:17:53] ▶Regarding the park rezoning
[03:17:55] ▶and, I think,
[03:17:57] ▶application for,
[03:18:00] ▶additional slot machines,
[03:18:04] ▶I'm gonna hold out on my position on that. I do acknowledge that lots of people
[03:18:09] ▶are
[03:18:11] ▶seemingly desperate for
[03:18:13] ▶additional local or tourist,
[03:18:16] ▶revenue.
[03:18:17] ▶And, however, I do I,
[03:18:20] ▶based on whatever what I heard what I've heard so far, both tonight and the the articles
[03:18:28] ▶discussing the
[03:18:30] ▶topic,
[03:18:33] ▶Speaker 38: just can't hear
[03:18:36] ▶Speaker 2: an adequate enough business case
[03:18:39] ▶that's
[03:18:40] ▶that balances
[03:18:41] ▶everything well.
[03:18:43] ▶So
[03:18:45] ▶the union rep, I think, a couple of speakers before me already discussed how
[03:18:50] ▶it how it creates social ramifications.
[03:18:54] ▶And, also,
[03:18:55] ▶and, also, the
[03:18:57] ▶revenue sharing
[03:18:58] ▶arrangements
[03:19:00] ▶may not
[03:19:01] ▶just may not
[03:19:03] ▶comp may not adequately
[03:19:05] ▶compensate for the social harms
[03:19:08] ▶that come out of it
[03:19:10] ▶that leads to the city having to spend extra,
[03:19:15] ▶extra expenses on on the on the fire service and police service
[03:19:21] ▶on suicide attempts and pull and just
[03:19:25] ▶widespread disorder.
[03:19:27] ▶I mean, the neighborhood,
[03:19:28] ▶like, the downtown East Side, the downtown area, it's already
[03:19:33] ▶already not safe in
[03:19:36] ▶a lot of the times because of the social disorder,
[03:19:40] ▶which led to the city having to
[03:19:44] ▶drastically increase the police
[03:19:47] ▶and, basically, the first responder budget. I'm not one of those
[03:19:51] ▶defundable police crowds, but I am concerned about the escalating costs in this area due to certain decision certain decisions that
[03:20:02] ▶not just this council, but
[03:20:04] ▶multiple previous councils have made.
[03:20:08] ▶I think there are couple a couple speakers who already spoke about a lack
[03:20:15] ▶of a lack of, like, physical
[03:20:19] ▶casino
[03:20:20] ▶demand even in Vegas,
[03:20:22] ▶let alone
[03:20:23] ▶there are plenty of other
[03:20:26] ▶there are plenty of other casinos
[03:20:28] ▶in even in local area already if you're not
[03:20:32] ▶provided that you're not crossing the border.
[03:20:36] ▶And, also,
[03:20:38] ▶there's also the online gambling elements that
[03:20:43] ▶that's just more convenient
[03:20:45] ▶even if you, let's say,
[03:20:48] ▶expand the the park casino and have, like, 300
[03:20:52] ▶or so more slot machines.
[03:20:55] ▶I think it's about 50%
[03:20:57] ▶increase in slot machines. Like, I don't think it can out compete
[03:21:02] ▶with the convenience factor of just
[03:21:06] ▶doing people doing it on their small smartphones
[03:21:09] ▶while they're on their Sky Train or while in they're snuggling on the couch or in their beds.
[03:21:17] ▶So
[03:21:18] ▶but I I do sympathize with the applicant with wanting to
[03:21:24] ▶apply
[03:21:25] ▶for the text amendment.
[03:21:27] ▶I mean, lots of people are desperate.
[03:21:30] ▶And
[03:21:31] ▶of all the additional jobs I've mentioned, it doesn't even sound like there's that many.
[03:21:37] ▶So
[03:21:39] ▶so, also, I also don't know and I know I I know I'm not supposed to ask questions about that this, but I also don't know the interaction between the city and the provincial government.
[03:21:51] ▶I do understand the provincial government is also pretty desperate
[03:21:56] ▶for revenue, but
[03:21:58] ▶I'm just not confident
[03:22:00] ▶that this would
[03:22:03] ▶bring the benefits as
[03:22:06] ▶many people here claim that
[03:22:09] ▶that that it will
[03:22:11] ▶happen. So
[03:22:14] ▶all these factors kinda pointed to me to not support this,
[03:22:18] ▶application.
[03:22:19] ▶Thank you.
[03:22:20] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, Stanley. Our next speaker is speaker 11, Jean Swanson by phone. Do we have Jean?
[03:22:26] ▶Go ahead, Jean.
[03:22:28] ▶Speaker 52: So I'm Jean Swanson, Vancouver resident opposed to this item in solidarity with Unite Here
[03:22:34] ▶and all the families and individuals who are harmed by gambling.
[03:22:38] ▶The reason to oppose this are clearly stated in the referral report under
[03:22:44] ▶anticipated harms and risks.
[03:22:46] ▶The quote from your own staff report,
[03:22:49] ▶expansion of slot machines, one of gambling's most
[03:22:53] ▶gambling forms most strongly linked to problem gambling is expected to increase
[03:22:59] ▶gambling related harm.
[03:23:01] ▶More quotes. Disproportionate
[03:23:03] ▶impacts on vulnerable groups. Higher risk of problem gambling occurs among people
[03:23:09] ▶experiencing mental health and substance use issues, low social connectedness.
[03:23:15] ▶More quotes. Problem gambling is least linked linked to increased risk of financial strain, family and domestic violence, substance use issues, and higher demand for health and social services.
[03:23:30] ▶More quotes. Research suggested this proportionate share of gambling revenue, particularly from slot machines, come from a minority of frequent
[03:23:39] ▶higher risk or problem gamblers. In BC, roughly five percent of players with problem gambling
[03:23:45] ▶generate about one third of revenue.
[03:23:48] ▶Players with incomes under 40 k are the highest are the second highest
[03:23:54] ▶risk group for problem gambling, leading to disproportionate
[03:23:58] ▶financial and health impacts
[03:24:00] ▶on residents least able to sub absorb
[03:24:04] ▶financial losses.
[03:24:06] ▶More quote, research suggests each instance
[03:24:09] ▶of problem gambling may negatively affect an estimated five to 10 other people through stress,
[03:24:17] ▶relationship strain, financial insecurity,
[03:24:19] ▶reduced
[03:24:21] ▶mental well-being, and I can go on and on.
[03:24:24] ▶Coastal Health more quote indicated that the HIA doesn't adequately
[03:24:29] ▶articulate the likelihood or the magnitude
[03:24:32] ▶of negative health or social impacts,
[03:24:35] ▶though such impacts are anticipated
[03:24:37] ▶from the proposed slot machine
[03:24:40] ▶expansion.
[03:24:41] ▶So
[03:24:43] ▶the proponent is trying to minimize the harm so they can make more profit.
[03:24:48] ▶I stand with the medical health officer and hope you vote this down.
[03:24:54] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, Jean. Our next speaker is, Bill Thielman, speaker number 12.
[03:25:01] ▶Speaker 1: Speaker 12 is not on the line.
[03:25:03] ▶Speaker 12: Thank you.
[03:25:05] ▶Speaker 33: Our speaker number 13 is withdrawn. Our next speaker is speaker 14, Tina Chung,
[03:25:10] ▶representative speaker.
[03:25:12] ▶Speaker 1: Is Tina on the line? Speaker 14 is not on the line.
[03:25:17] ▶Speaker 33: Speaker number 15, Ruth Cherry.
[03:25:25] ▶Is Ruth just coming from the lobby? Okay. Great. We'll just give her a moment.
[03:25:43] ▶Good evening, Ruth.
[03:25:45] ▶We'll be using the podium here. Yeah. I didn't know I was up for her. No. You're good timing.
[03:25:51] ▶Speaker 32: You have up to five minutes, and, just a reminder to state if you're a resident and, if you're in opposition or in favor. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Good evening. Madam chair and council, my name is Ruth Cherry. I'm a long term resident of Vancouver. I've worked in the downtown core for forty years. I am opposed
[03:26:07] ▶to an increase of slot machines at 39 dash 65 Smythe Street.
[03:26:12] ▶From the present number of 600 to 900,
[03:26:15] ▶and according to the applicant, the existing casino floor space can accommodate up to 1,200 slot machines.
[03:26:22] ▶So it may not be out of the question for yet another increase to be requested in the future.
[03:26:29] ▶So taking note of the findings of the applicant's health impact assessment regarding the following problems with the expansion of slot machines.
[03:26:38] ▶Problem gambling,
[03:26:39] ▶disproportionate impacts on vulnerable groups, higher risk of problem gambling occurs amongst people experiencing
[03:26:46] ▶mental health and substance use issues.
[03:26:50] ▶Related economic health and social harms.
[03:26:53] ▶Problem gambling is linked to increased risk of financial strain, family and domestic violence,
[03:26:59] ▶substance use issues,
[03:27:01] ▶and higher demand for health and social services.
[03:27:05] ▶Revenue
[03:27:06] ▶concentrated amongst higher risk players.
[03:27:09] ▶So research suggests that a disproportionate
[03:27:12] ▶share of gambling revenue, particularly from slot machines, comes from a minority of frequent,
[03:27:18] ▶higher risk, or problem gamblers.
[03:27:20] ▶So in BC, roughly 5% of players with problem gambling
[03:27:25] ▶generates about one third of revenue.
[03:27:27] ▶And this seems to be amongst people in the $40,000,
[03:27:32] ▶bracket.
[03:27:34] ▶What my concern is the ripple effects as well. So domestic violence
[03:27:40] ▶Speaker 33: is
[03:27:41] ▶rife.
[03:27:43] ▶Speaker 32: That affects the family unit. It affects the children. It affects their future.
[03:27:48] ▶And when
[03:27:49] ▶I hear that
[03:27:51] ▶Vancouver has a lower percentage or or ratio
[03:27:55] ▶of slot machines
[03:27:57] ▶as compared to, say, Richmond,
[03:28:00] ▶Burnaby.
[03:28:01] ▶I don't really understand the logic
[03:28:03] ▶because we have the Downtown East Side, which is rife
[03:28:07] ▶with
[03:28:08] ▶people who are homeless on drugs
[03:28:12] ▶for various reasons. They have mental health problems.
[03:28:15] ▶Some people are homeless
[03:28:17] ▶too because they've gambled,
[03:28:20] ▶in some cases,
[03:28:21] ▶away everything.
[03:28:24] ▶So I I don't think it's a really valid point.
[03:28:27] ▶The public benefits of the CAC contribution
[03:28:31] ▶from 600,000
[03:28:33] ▶to 900,000
[03:28:34] ▶in 2028,
[03:28:36] ▶it does not ameliorate the damage done to the community
[03:28:40] ▶by additional access to gambling.
[03:28:44] ▶So
[03:28:45] ▶when
[03:28:46] ▶there's
[03:28:47] ▶this thought that, well,
[03:28:51] ▶we can ameliorate
[03:28:52] ▶some of the damage by throwing money at it. It's kind of like going to the Downtown East Side and throwing around a bunch of heroin and saying, well, we'll put some safe houses here.
[03:29:05] ▶That'll take care of the problem. It doesn't. And it's the same here.
[03:29:10] ▶So
[03:29:13] ▶I don't think
[03:29:15] ▶this is a good excuse for our government
[03:29:18] ▶that an additional funding, I believe, is 10%
[03:29:21] ▶to make gambling even easier to accelerate.
[03:29:25] ▶The revenue that it receives from the machines in place, let alone additional ones, is not worth it due to the strain on our societal fabric and the impact of our health and police budgets.
[03:29:37] ▶Some lose everything and thus become homeless as I mentioned before,
[03:29:42] ▶and we don't need yet more inhabitants
[03:29:46] ▶that are homeless in the Downtown East Side. I ask that you please take additional time
[03:29:52] ▶to look over the studies that have been mentioned earlier
[03:29:56] ▶before approving this expansion. Thank you.
[03:30:00] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much.
[03:30:01] ▶Our next speaker is 16, Laura Stannard.
[03:30:07] ▶Speaker 28: Good evening, council.
[03:30:09] ▶My name is Laura Stannard, and I do not support another 300 slot machines at Park Casino.
[03:30:16] ▶The last time I remember a Vancouver council trying to expand gaming was in 2011,
[03:30:22] ▶and I was a member of the Vancouver City Planning Commission.
[03:30:26] ▶I wrote the presentation we made to council.
[03:30:28] ▶The gist of it, which is all I can really recall, was that Vancouver residents had repeatedly
[03:30:34] ▶spoken loudly and clearly about casino gambling in Downtown Vancouver
[03:30:39] ▶and did not want any increases.
[03:30:42] ▶I disagree with the advice you have received that a public hearing is satisfactory
[03:30:48] ▶consultation for this matter.
[03:30:50] ▶I only accidentally found out the casino had applied for 300 more slot machines through the Unite Here's Facebook
[03:30:57] ▶post,
[03:30:58] ▶So I think a much broader consultation
[03:31:00] ▶is needed.
[03:31:02] ▶What is the rush?
[03:31:04] ▶Would it not be beneficial
[03:31:06] ▶to everyone to know if attitudes towards expanding casino gambling in Downtown Vancouver have changed in the last twenty years?
[03:31:14] ▶And now listening to other speakers, I find there are research reports on problem gambling in BC to be released in the spring.
[03:31:22] ▶What is the rush?
[03:31:25] ▶If you haven't been to a casino lately,
[03:31:28] ▶you may not realize how science has helped redesign
[03:31:32] ▶slot machines so that they are even more effective at releasing our brains' dopamine neurotransmitters.
[03:31:39] ▶They are now the most addictive form of casino gambling, causing
[03:31:43] ▶more problem gambling and addictive behavior than any other gambling activity. They are the crack cocaine
[03:31:50] ▶of gambling.
[03:31:52] ▶Why does Park Casino want another 300?
[03:31:55] ▶Well, because they are also the most lucrative form of gambling for the casino operators
[03:32:00] ▶as opposed to
[03:32:02] ▶the users of slot machines.
[03:32:05] ▶For a couple of years, I worked for Information Vancouver when it was contracted to answer BC
[03:32:11] ▶one eight hundred's problem gambling line.
[03:32:14] ▶I experienced vicarious trauma answering those calls.
[03:32:18] ▶The loss and shame
[03:32:20] ▶destroys families.
[03:32:21] ▶I could go on about them, but I managed to review some of the letters that were sent to council back in 2011,
[03:32:28] ▶and they are still relevant.
[03:32:30] ▶From doctor John Blatherwick,
[03:32:32] ▶order of Canada, Vancouver's chief medical officer from 1984
[03:32:38] ▶to 2007,
[03:32:39] ▶writes,
[03:32:41] ▶all addictions show that the more available a product is, the more of the problem the addiction becomes.
[03:32:48] ▶Placing this large addiction center next to the sports centers where mainly younger males go ensures a fresh supply of new attics for the casinos.
[03:32:57] ▶There are already more than enough casinos in the Lower Mainland. So to attract more into this one center,
[03:33:04] ▶new recruits are needed.
[03:33:05] ▶Adding newer and younger gamblers ensures more people will
[03:33:10] ▶become addicted to gambling. And I was gonna read another that 19 police officers wrote, but I'm worried about time.
[03:33:18] ▶So I'm going to jump to
[03:33:24] ▶from a man from the planning
[03:33:27] ▶a man that many from the planning community, the Downtown
[03:33:31] ▶East Side, UBC, and beyond remember with great love,
[03:33:36] ▶The late Nathan Edelson wrote,
[03:33:39] ▶enabling addiction to gambling as a public policy doesn't feel right.
[03:33:45] ▶He went on,
[03:33:47] ▶more than a decade ago, mayor Philip Owen had the wisdom to understand that addiction to illegal drugs is a public health issue.
[03:33:55] ▶It is time for us to understand that this is also true of addiction to gambling.
[03:34:00] ▶I would suggest a four pillar approach to reduce
[03:34:04] ▶government's addiction to gambling.
[03:34:07] ▶Nathan went on to delineate step by step all four pillars of how government could recover from their addiction to gambling.
[03:34:15] ▶But I will make this simple.
[03:34:18] ▶For now,
[03:34:19] ▶just say
[03:34:21] ▶no. 300 more slot machines will not increase the amount of fun in Downtown Vancouver.
[03:34:26] ▶It will increase the amount of loss, shame, and misery in all of our communities.
[03:34:32] ▶Thank you, and I ask that you do not approve this application or, as others have asked, that you defer it until after these spring reports have been released.
[03:34:44] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you for your comments this evening. Our next speaker is speaker 17, Luis Villegas.
[03:34:49] ▶See Luis coming.
[03:34:50] ▶Do we have Luis's presentation?
[03:34:55] ▶Okay. I'll check.
[03:34:57] ▶Good evening, Luis.
[03:34:59] ▶Speaker 10: Do you have a presentation this evening? I do, but we're gonna not use it. I've scrambled my slides to reorganize the presentation. For this one, I can just talk. Okay. Go ahead.
[03:35:09] ▶My name is Luis Villegas. I'm a Vancouver resident since 1985.
[03:35:14] ▶I oppose adding slot machines to this casino, and I also oppose casinos in this city, period.
[03:35:21] ▶Government is once again skirting its responsibility
[03:35:25] ▶by asking the casinos to self regulate.
[03:35:28] ▶Government making casinos responsible for casino data
[03:35:32] ▶is like asking the masked man robbing you at knifepoint
[03:35:36] ▶to tell you how sharp the knife is and how much harm it will do.
[03:35:41] ▶I would feel safer, for example,
[03:35:44] ▶if BC Coastal Health
[03:35:46] ▶partnered with our universities to monitor and report both harm
[03:35:50] ▶to the community and profits to the casino.
[03:35:55] ▶Slot machine harm is well documented.
[03:35:59] ▶The BCLC's
[03:36:00] ▶claim tonight that most people who gamble in BC do so safely
[03:36:04] ▶is not supported by independent studies from other jurisdictions.
[03:36:09] ▶A study led by the University of Massachusetts,
[03:36:12] ▶Armhurst,
[03:36:13] ▶in 2024
[03:36:15] ▶found that 90% of all casino revenue is taken from problem gamblers.
[03:36:20] ▶The applicant is reporting that number as being three times smaller.
[03:36:26] ▶Among players with gambling addictions, the second largest largest cohort
[03:36:31] ▶earned below median incomes.
[03:36:34] ▶For that co cohort, losses at the casino are reported as causing financial instability,
[03:36:40] ▶home violence, family harm, and even suicides.
[03:36:44] ▶Claims that only in Vancouver, most gamblers are problem free
[03:36:49] ▶pushes credulity
[03:36:50] ▶to the breaking point.
[03:36:53] ▶Slot machines account for up to 80% of gun gambling revenue,
[03:36:58] ▶Thus, an increase
[03:37:00] ▶calculated to maximize casino revenues
[03:37:02] ▶will also maximize
[03:37:04] ▶social risk and harm.
[03:37:06] ▶In terms of the ratio of slots to game tables, the usual breakdown is about 80% to 20%.
[03:37:13] ▶In the Lower Mainland, that breakdown is 95%
[03:37:16] ▶slots and 5% tables.
[03:37:19] ▶At this casino, after the 300 slots are added, the ratio of slot machines to table games will be 92%
[03:37:26] ▶to 8%.
[03:37:30] ▶To the chair's question, how do we make sure there is no gambling addiction? This would be the previous chair.
[03:37:36] ▶The sure answer is very simple. Only by closing all casinos in Vancouver
[03:37:50] ▶metro municipalities have casinos. Vancouver should join ranks with the other two thirds.
[03:37:53] ▶Vancouver should join ranks with the other two thirds.
[03:37:58] ▶Two government reports are imminent.
[03:38:01] ▶Approving this expansion without waiting
[03:38:03] ▶will force electors in October into a binary choice.
[03:38:07] ▶Vote for a government captured by industry
[03:38:10] ▶or vote for good government.
[03:38:12] ▶Speaker 12: Thank you.
[03:38:14] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much for your comments. Our next speaker is Howard Blank, speaker number 18. Do we have Howard on the line?
[03:38:21] ▶Speaker 53: Yes. Go ahead, Howard. Good evening. My name is good evening. My name is Howard Blank. I'm a proud resident of Vancouver, BC, and I'm in favor of the proposal for Park 3965
[03:38:31] ▶Smythe Street.
[03:38:33] ▶I have over forty years experience in the gaming industry, including being a team member at the opening of the first stand alone casino property, which was Great Canadian Casino's Holiday Inn property at 711 West Broadway in 1986,
[03:38:45] ▶and subsequently opening casino entertainment properties in BC, across Canada, and in Europe.
[03:38:51] ▶My last post was VP of media entertainment and responsible gambling.
[03:38:55] ▶One fact I wanted to bring up to councils. Did you know that at one time, there were over seven charity casinos operating in Vancouver nightly
[03:39:03] ▶within the city limits, including the West Broadway location I mentioned, Hastings Street, Chinatown, Richard Street, the Blue Boy Hotel, the Frasier Arms Hotel, the Biltmore, the PNE, and others. Less casinos with modernization and proper oversight were welcomed by all when BCLC and government changed the model in the nineteen nineties.
[03:39:21] ▶I would argue that closing all casinos in BC will simply drive traffic to an unregulated and unsecure market.
[03:39:27] ▶The park and BCLC have been strong corporate citizens since the opening of the property in September 2017.
[03:39:33] ▶This is not an application for a new gaming venue, but one to augment the current gaming supply inside a highly regulated and responsible facility.
[03:39:42] ▶The increase requested for slot machines is a matter of guest service options and does not equate to a rush to gamble with the addiction. And I do understand that addiction is serious, and I agree that there are a small percentage of the population that are addicted to gambling.
[03:39:57] ▶More gaming options in the form of slots will enable the park to offer more choice to guests, meet critical ebb and flow and demand from events, tourism,
[03:40:05] ▶and other other events on property and in the surrounding area as the park is right in the center of the truly entertainment district that that I would say in Vancouver.
[03:40:15] ▶The park goes above and beyond being an engaged employer and responsible corporate and gaming citizen in Vancouver.
[03:40:21] ▶They hire vulnerable and hard to employ persons.
[03:40:24] ▶They follow global leading RG policies and procedures
[03:40:27] ▶in concert with BCLC and GPEP. In fact, Karen Gray, who spoke this evening, just today was recognized by the safer gambling champion
[03:40:35] ▶regulating the game global award as a world finalist for her and her team at park to be announced in Sydney later this year.
[03:40:43] ▶Now I know firsthand that park gives back. I sit on many boards, including varieties, Ajax Ranch, PADS, Odd Squad, and others. I've also helped raise as a charity auctioneer over $1,000,000,000
[03:40:54] ▶for countless local and national organizations,
[03:40:57] ▶including many that are adjacent to the park, including
[03:41:00] ▶Downtown Eastside Women's, Center, NAILOC Society, Doctor Peter Aid Center, and Saint Paul's Foundation, Loving Spoonful, and many more. I'm grateful to the park for their direct support of many of my fundraising galas and events.
[03:41:14] ▶The park is always there whether donating auction items to the charities, giving up staff's time, talent, and treasure, including donating found money to so many key organizations throughout Vancouver. Now these funds are directed by staff committees and go above and beyond financial commitments that coincide
[03:41:29] ▶with the park's license and their commitment to the city.
[03:41:33] ▶A few key facts. Every slot machine at every casino in this province
[03:41:37] ▶have clocks on them so that, players are able to see immediately what time it is and how long they've been playing. And I believe that the average complement of slots in the major gaming properties in the DVRD
[03:41:49] ▶is roughly 1,150
[03:41:51] ▶per property. That is almost double the current complement at park.
[03:41:55] ▶I fully recommend the approval for the park, which is part of a highly regulated safe and secure gaming environment as opposed to online gambling with zero benefits to anyone
[03:42:04] ▶and off often only giving the money to offshore operators.
[03:42:08] ▶I applaud BCLC, GPB, and the BC gaming operators of which Park Casino is an outstanding partner with their request to offer great choice and meet peak demands for current clients and guests and our important tourism sector with two outstanding hotels and multiple restaurants on property.
[03:42:24] ▶Therefore, I urge council to please allow for this small additional complement of machines, the 50% request, so that the park can continue their modernization
[03:42:33] ▶and offer choice to the customers who visit them. Thank you.
[03:42:37] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much for your comments this evening. Our next speaker is speaker Naithid Ma Rowena Alivio.
[03:42:49] ▶Speaker 28: Welcome.
[03:42:57] ▶Speaker 54: Good evening, mayor and council members.
[03:43:01] ▶My name is Rowanna Alivio. I'm a resident of Vancouver,
[03:43:04] ▶and I have proudly worked at Park Casino
[03:43:07] ▶for twelve years.
[03:43:09] ▶I am also actively involved in representing workers as part of Uniphore Local three thousand.
[03:43:17] ▶Over those twelve years,
[03:43:19] ▶I have seen
[03:43:21] ▶our workplace at its strongest.
[03:43:24] ▶And I have also seen
[03:43:26] ▶how much our members have struggled,
[03:43:29] ▶including myself,
[03:43:30] ▶since the pandemic.
[03:43:32] ▶I am here today to stand
[03:43:35] ▶and to support the proposal to increase the number of slot machines at park.
[03:43:40] ▶For many people, this decision may look like numbers on paper.
[03:43:46] ▶600 machines
[03:43:47] ▶increasing to 900.
[03:43:49] ▶But for us,
[03:43:51] ▶those numbers represent ours,
[03:43:54] ▶income, and stability.
[03:43:57] ▶Since COVID,
[03:43:59] ▶business levels have not fully recovered.
[03:44:02] ▶Many of our coworkers are not getting maximized hours.
[03:44:07] ▶When hours dropped,
[03:44:09] ▶income drops.
[03:44:11] ▶When income drops,
[03:44:13] ▶families
[03:44:14] ▶feel it immediately.
[03:44:17] ▶Some members worry about qualifying for benefits.
[03:44:21] ▶Benefits that cover prescriptions,
[03:44:24] ▶dental care, and essential health needs.
[03:44:29] ▶In twelve years,
[03:44:31] ▶I have built relationships
[03:44:32] ▶with my coworkers.
[03:44:34] ▶I have seen their dedication.
[03:44:38] ▶I have seen
[03:44:39] ▶them show up through difficult times.
[03:44:43] ▶What we are asking for is not excessive growth.
[03:44:47] ▶It is the opportunity
[03:44:49] ▶to remain competitive and protect good union
[03:44:53] ▶jobs.
[03:44:54] ▶Even with this increase,
[03:44:56] ▶park would still have fewer machines than the River Rock Casino Resort,
[03:45:01] ▶Granville Casino, and Cascade Langley.
[03:45:04] ▶This is about fairness and sustainability.
[03:45:08] ▶We have already seen what happened with the closure of Hastings
[03:45:14] ▶Rare Course
[03:45:15] ▶a race course, I mean. Jobs can disappear quickly in this industry.
[03:45:21] ▶If park continues to decline,
[03:45:24] ▶hundreds of workers and their families could be affected.
[03:45:29] ▶Park employees
[03:45:31] ▶are members of this community.
[03:45:34] ▶We pay taxes here.
[03:45:36] ▶We raise our families here.
[03:45:40] ▶And gaming revenue supports public services and charities that benefit the city as a whole.
[03:45:46] ▶Keeping gaming in a regulated
[03:45:49] ▶in person environment
[03:45:51] ▶also provides
[03:45:52] ▶oversight
[03:45:53] ▶and accountability
[03:45:54] ▶that online platforms cannot fully replicate.
[03:45:59] ▶In addition,
[03:46:00] ▶many seniors in our community
[03:46:03] ▶choose to visit part not only to play,
[03:46:06] ▶but to be in a social,
[03:46:09] ▶supervised environment
[03:46:11] ▶rather than staying isolated
[03:46:13] ▶at home.
[03:46:14] ▶Keeping gaming in a regulated in person setting ensures
[03:46:18] ▶there are responsible
[03:46:20] ▶gaming
[03:46:21] ▶safeguards and trained staff present,
[03:46:25] ▶which is far safer
[03:46:26] ▶than individuals gambling alone
[03:46:29] ▶online without oversight.
[03:46:33] ▶respectfully ask council to consider the human impact of this decision.
[03:46:38] ▶Behind every machine
[03:46:40] ▶is a worker.
[03:46:42] ▶Behind every job
[03:46:43] ▶is a family.
[03:46:45] ▶On behalf of my coworkers
[03:46:47] ▶and fellow union members,
[03:46:49] ▶I urged you to support this proposal.
[03:46:52] ▶Thank you for your time.
[03:46:55] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you for your comments this evening. Council or speakers, we're just gonna pause for a moment, just given the hour, and I'm gonna canvas council on,
[03:47:04] ▶continuation of these items.
[03:47:06] ▶I would like to propose,
[03:47:08] ▶given that we're almost nearly done speakers on this item,
[03:47:11] ▶and we have only a handful of speakers on item three,
[03:47:15] ▶that
[03:47:16] ▶we extend past 10PM to complete,
[03:47:20] ▶items two and three.
[03:47:22] ▶That includes hearing speakers doing debate and decision this evening and referring item four to the reserve date, which I understand is March 4.
[03:47:30] ▶So I'm putting that out for
[03:47:32] ▶consideration.
[03:47:34] ▶So
[03:47:40] ▶oh, sorry. My apologies, councilor Claussen.
[03:47:43] ▶Councilor Bly, go ahead.
[03:47:47] ▶Speaker 55: Thanks very much, chair. I would like to move, a motion that we finish this item and,
[03:47:56] ▶move item three and four to a future date.
[03:48:00] ▶Speaker 33: Okay. That motion's been moved. Is there a seconder for that? That's been seconded by councilor Clausen.
[03:48:07] ▶That is debatable, though. So councilors, if you were on the queue before to speak, you can put yourselves back on the queue.
[03:48:14] ▶Councilor Kirby Young.
[03:48:16] ▶Speaker 9: Yeah. I I'm just,
[03:48:18] ▶a question before council decides on that and considering what's on the floor. Is the next reserve date would it be March 4? Is that the
[03:48:26] ▶scheduled date? Correct. March 4 at 3PM. Okay. And and noting that we just have five speakers for item three.
[03:48:33] ▶I'm assuming that the applicant and all the folks are here for that one at this point.
[03:48:38] ▶Speaker 33: I'll check with staff. I'm seeing a nod from staff. Yes. They are here. Okay.
[03:48:44] ▶Speaker 9: Just noting in terms of,
[03:48:46] ▶since it's a debatable motion that recognizing that we do have all the folks that have been waiting for four hours here in the applicant here, and there are only five speakers to that item.
[03:48:56] ▶I would prefer to see a motion that completes,
[03:49:00] ▶as you suggested, three item two and three, and then defers
[03:49:04] ▶item four to
[03:49:06] ▶March 4.
[03:49:09] ▶But I know there's a motion on the four, so that would be my reason for not supporting this one. Just Counselor, you're also yes. You're also able to strike and replace that if you wish.
[03:49:21] ▶Sure. We can Okay.
[03:49:23] ▶Yeah. I so that one was moved in second. Is that right? It was. Okay. Then I would move to strike and replace it that we complete item three and four this evening and
[03:49:32] ▶ref sorry. Two and three. I misspoke.
[03:49:34] ▶And refer item four to the reserve date on March 4, which commences at 3PM.
[03:49:40] ▶Speaker 33: K. Can I get a seconder for that?
[03:49:43] ▶Happy to second. Seconded by councilor Zhou.
[03:49:46] ▶Again, that is debatable counsel. That is the motion on the floor. Just, again, to reframe, it is,
[03:49:52] ▶to,
[03:49:53] ▶complete items this item, which is item two, complete item three, and refer item four,
[03:49:59] ▶to,
[03:50:00] ▶March 4 reserve.
[03:50:02] ▶Councilor councilor Bly.
[03:50:05] ▶Speaker 55: Thanks very much. I suspect I'm probably just, a little,
[03:50:10] ▶still recovering from the 1AM,
[03:50:12] ▶public hearing from last week, and want to just be sure that we're,
[03:50:17] ▶not risking, the public needing to stick around,
[03:50:20] ▶close to midnight like we did last week. So if if we're confident with, with the setup in the chambers that that, item will move, I I I will say that due to East Coast meetings in the morning, I will drop off after this item, but I'm happy to support it. Thank you, councilor Blythe. Appreciate it.
[03:50:38] ▶Speaker 33: And seeing no further speakers on that item, so I am gonna call the question. Everyone's clear on the the
[03:50:44] ▶we could do a recorded vote if that's helpful. Yep. And I'll take a vote assist in favor of clerks.
[03:50:50] ▶Speaker 1: Chair. It's councilor Meisner. Can I get a vote assist in favor, please? Yes.
[03:50:55] ▶Speaker 12: Thank you.
[03:51:10] ▶Speaker 33: And councilor Zhou, we need your vote. Oh, I think it just hasn't come through.
[03:51:16] ▶No. All good. All good.
[03:51:27] ▶We're good?
[03:51:31] ▶Thank you. Okay. Thank you, counsel. That passed unanimously, and I do appreciate, the flexibility because we did have,
[03:51:38] ▶oh,
[03:51:39] ▶oh, an amendment. Sorry. I need one more vote.
[03:51:42] ▶So please vote again.
[03:51:47] ▶So, again, same,
[03:51:49] ▶to again, just to repeat, it is to,
[03:51:52] ▶complete items two and three this evening and refer item four to March 4.
[03:51:57] ▶Works. Can we confirm that no one's voted?
[03:52:00] ▶Speaker 1: Yeah. Vote assistant paper, please. Councilor Meister.
[03:52:04] ▶Speaker 33: Vote assistant. Oh, no. It's alright. It's popped up. Bear with us for those of you in the public. Just a moment.
[03:52:16] ▶And with councilor Kirby, I just need your Great.
[03:52:19] ▶Thank you. Thank you, council. That does pass unanimously.
[03:52:23] ▶And and I again, just reiterating, thank you for the flexibility for all of counsel because I realized we've had a number of late nights,
[03:52:29] ▶but we do have a lot of business before us. So, we will continue with speakers.
[03:52:34] ▶And our next speaker is speaker 20
[03:52:37] ▶Vanya
[03:52:39] ▶Jellek. I'm not sure if please don't
[03:52:41] ▶did I get it the first time? Vanya is good. Vanya? It's good.
[03:52:45] ▶Go ahead. You have up to five minutes to address counsel.
[03:52:49] ▶Speaker 56: Thank you very much. Good evening, and, happy Lunar New Year.
[03:52:53] ▶My name is Vanya Jelich, and I'm a resident of Vancouver. I live and work in the West End slash downtown.
[03:52:59] ▶I've spent twenty eight years in, in this city. Vancouver is my home now,
[03:53:05] ▶and, I deeply care about the quality of life here, not just for me, but for everybody.
[03:53:11] ▶I'm here today to oppose the proposal to expand the slots, at our casino.
[03:53:15] ▶My concern is that the casino is asking for a 50 increase,
[03:53:19] ▶50% increase in slots, a major expansion in into gambling, which the city's residents won't see, but sorry. But the city's residents won't see any substant substantial increase in community benefits,
[03:53:31] ▶if any at all.
[03:53:33] ▶The casino can make $20,000,000
[03:53:35] ▶in this expansion, but it's only offering the city about a $150,000,
[03:53:40] ▶for the first year to offset social impacts and a little more the year after that.
[03:53:45] ▶Quite frankly, I find this insulting.
[03:53:48] ▶What's more, I recently heard that Park owes the city of Vancouver $400,000,
[03:53:53] ▶in inflation adjusted payments under the responsible gaming agreement.
[03:53:58] ▶How long has it been that Park hasn't paid the city?
[03:54:01] ▶How much longer must we wait?
[03:54:03] ▶Mind you, Park had agreed to this payment.
[03:54:06] ▶Now we're, now they're asking for the city even more while giving us less.
[03:54:12] ▶If we fall behind if I, for example, were to fall behind on my mortgage,
[03:54:16] ▶my landlord and bank, they can evict me.
[03:54:19] ▶They can foreclose my home.
[03:54:22] ▶I'm concerned that the council here will let the casino
[03:54:26] ▶just let it slide.
[03:54:29] ▶I'm concerned that, they'll let the owners off the hook.
[03:54:35] ▶Who in the meantime is gonna pay for, these increase,
[03:54:38] ▶for the increased rates of gambling, addiction, and policing?
[03:54:42] ▶Vancouver.
[03:54:43] ▶All of us. We're gonna have to pay for this. We're gonna have to foot the bill.
[03:54:49] ▶Personally, I would say that the cost for this proposal far outweigh the benefits.
[03:54:53] ▶That's why I asked the council to reject this proposal.
[03:54:58] ▶Just based on what I've heard here today,
[03:55:01] ▶I heard about robust gambling prevention.
[03:55:05] ▶I do not see any,
[03:55:08] ▶I I do not see any results to it. There's still gambling happening. There's still,
[03:55:14] ▶what did you call them? A problem problem problematic
[03:55:17] ▶gambling.
[03:55:18] ▶It's still happening. It has not been reduced.
[03:55:21] ▶More slots is gonna increase it.
[03:55:24] ▶I hear about some,
[03:55:27] ▶data of the effects of gambling being available in spring.
[03:55:31] ▶Why are we voting on this now then?
[03:55:33] ▶If the information is coming out in a couple of months, there's really no need to be doing this right now.
[03:55:38] ▶And,
[03:55:39] ▶last thing,
[03:55:43] ▶I just do not understand how online gambling
[03:55:46] ▶encourages drinking
[03:55:48] ▶and fighting in the streets.
[03:55:51] ▶Casino does.
[03:55:55] ▶And I'm just gonna leave you with that.
[03:55:57] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much. Thank you for staying this evening to speak.
[03:56:02] ▶Our next speaker is speaker 21, Melody Ma.
[03:56:06] ▶Speaker 35: Good evening.
[03:56:07] ▶My name is Melody Ma. I oppose Park Casino's request to add 300 more slot machines.
[03:56:13] ▶Adding 300 machines is essentially dropping a brand new casino right onto the edge of Chinatown on the downtown East Side. We know that casinos target Chinatowns and immigrant populations.
[03:56:23] ▶Before the pandemic, Park ran shuttle buses from the Chinatown Memorial Plaza right straight into the casino doors and back. Those buses were filled with Chinatown seniors and retirees.
[03:56:36] ▶Physical slot machines are a unique draw to Chinese seniors because unlike online gambling, they don't require tech skills and they bypass language barriers. To say these additional stop slot machines won't increase problem gambling
[03:56:50] ▶just because online options exist is simply naive.
[03:56:54] ▶It ignores the specific accessibility of a physical casino with more slot machines to seniors.
[03:57:00] ▶If you look at Park's current advertisements,
[03:57:03] ▶they aren't even hiding their targeting of East Asian seniors. They have a massive outdoor marketing campaign featuring an older East Asian woman in a jade necklace with a slot machine literally in her mouth. Park's own vice president of marketing is on the record stating that this image represents their, quote, unquote, core players.
[03:57:23] ▶This is a predatory strategy aimed at a community already struggling with affordability,
[03:57:28] ▶gentrification,
[03:57:29] ▶and isolation.
[03:57:31] ▶These folks aren't high rollers. They're community seniors, and we are watching them be sold to a thrill that often leads to financial ruin.
[03:57:40] ▶Just this past month, a friend in the community had to support a Chinese senior
[03:57:44] ▶who nearly became unhoused due to a gambling addiction.
[03:57:48] ▶I've heard many stories of Chinese families in the community suffering social or financial consequences due to gambling addiction afflicting the family,
[03:57:57] ▶at large.
[03:57:58] ▶We know that many Chinese seniors already take the 23 bus to park, and adding more machines coupled with this predatory marketing will only worsen the situation.
[03:58:08] ▶Despite the high visible overrepresentation
[03:58:11] ▶of Chinese and East Asian players in casinos,
[03:58:13] ▶there is a significant cultural stigma around gambling addiction,
[03:58:18] ▶which often prevents individuals from seeking support. The stigma compounded by language barriers likely results in the underreporting of East Asian demographics with problem gambling
[03:58:29] ▶amongst
[03:58:30] ▶problem gambling statistics.
[03:58:33] ▶Vancouver is not alone in this fight against casinos. Rushing And Queens, New York, home to a predominantly Asian immigrant community, is currently battling a mega casino plan. In Chicago's Chinatown, community members are sounding the alarm over an hourly casino shuttle that targets their Chinese seniors. This is a pattern of predatory targeting
[03:58:53] ▶by casinos, and Park is doubling down on a business model built on this exploitation.
[03:58:59] ▶The increased revenue from this expansion, the very few jobs, and the so called entertainment value will come directly out of the pockets of the people who can least afford it. It comes at the cost of family stability
[03:59:11] ▶and the mental health of our neighbors.
[03:59:14] ▶The health impact assessment already anticipated that this will have a, quote, unquote, disproportionate,
[03:59:20] ▶disproportionate
[03:59:21] ▶impact on vulnerable groups with revenue concentrated among higher play risk players, and no amount of money is worth the exploitation
[03:59:30] ▶of the most vulnerable people of our communities. So please reject this proposal. Tell HARC that Vancouver does not need 300 more ways to exploit the most vulnerable residents. Thank you for your time.
[03:59:43] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, Melody. Our next speaker is Shanna Abanitala,
[03:59:48] ▶speaker number 22.
[03:59:55] ▶Speaker 41: Evening.
[03:59:57] ▶Speaker 57: Hi. Is there any way we can put this down?
[04:00:05] ▶Speaker 32: Sorry. I'm just short. I need to see my paper.
[04:00:08] ▶No problem. Thank you so much. There you go. K.
[04:00:12] ▶Speaker 57: Good evening, council members.
[04:00:14] ▶My name is Shanna Abonitalia,
[04:00:16] ▶and I have had the privilege of working at Parcocino
[04:00:20] ▶for twenty one years.
[04:00:22] ▶I currently served as a unit chair
[04:00:25] ▶and as part of the bargaining committee representing over 600
[04:00:29] ▶unionized members through Uniphore Local three thousand
[04:00:33] ▶at this establishment.
[04:00:35] ▶I have also represented
[04:00:37] ▶uniform members in the hospitality
[04:00:39] ▶and gaming sector in BC.
[04:00:42] ▶I am here today to advocate on behalf of my colleagues,
[04:00:46] ▶friends, and fellow union members who rely on park for their livelihoods.
[04:00:51] ▶Since the onset of COVID pandemic, our casino has faced significant challenges in its recovery,
[04:00:57] ▶and our members have struggled to regain stability amid rising inflation and living costs in our city.
[04:01:04] ▶Business levels remain low, and many of our members are now receiving the hours needed to sustain their earnings.
[04:01:11] ▶This situation
[04:01:12] ▶threatens their benefits,
[04:01:14] ▶benefits crucial to the health and well-being of their families.
[04:01:19] ▶If this application is approved by the council,
[04:01:22] ▶it will support the maintenance and creation of good jobs for all workers at park and in the community.
[04:01:29] ▶Increased business levels would lead to the greater stability
[04:01:33] ▶for our members and provide a stronger basis for negotiating a fair contract that benefits all employers employees.
[04:01:42] ▶It is important to emphasize that this proposal
[04:01:45] ▶does not entail a substantial increase in the number of gaming machines.
[04:01:50] ▶Even with approval,
[04:01:52] ▶park will still have fewer machines than other major casinos
[04:01:56] ▶such as Grand Villa, River Rock, and Cascade Langley.
[04:02:02] ▶Beyond providing employment,
[04:02:04] ▶park
[04:02:05] ▶actively contributes
[04:02:06] ▶to the community
[04:02:07] ▶and support local charities.
[04:02:10] ▶The revenue generated by our operations
[04:02:15] ▶helps BC government
[04:02:16] ▶maintain essential service and uphold affordability
[04:02:20] ▶for taxpayers.
[04:02:22] ▶Approving this application
[04:02:24] ▶will also encourage a return in person
[04:02:27] ▶regulated gaming environments
[04:02:30] ▶and increasing number of gamblers
[04:02:32] ▶are shifting to online platforms,
[04:02:35] ▶which poses challenges for individuals
[04:02:38] ▶and society as a whole.
[04:02:40] ▶It is imperative
[04:02:42] ▶that we motivate individuals
[04:02:44] ▶to return to safe,
[04:02:46] ▶properly regulated casinos such as park.
[04:02:50] ▶On behalf of the workers I represent,
[04:02:52] ▶I respectfully
[04:02:53] ▶urge the council
[04:02:54] ▶to carefully consider
[04:02:56] ▶these points and to remain vigilant and against the agendas of unrelated third parties who may not prioritize our workers
[04:03:03] ▶or our community's interest.
[04:03:06] ▶Thank you for your time and your consideration.
[04:03:09] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much for your comments.
[04:03:11] ▶Our next speaker is Helen
[04:03:13] ▶Au.
[04:03:16] ▶Is there Helen on the line?
[04:03:18] ▶Hello? Yes. Go ahead.
[04:03:22] ▶Speaker 24: Fantastic.
[04:03:24] ▶I thank you, counsel, for giving me the opportunity to speak tonight. My name is Helen Pahu. I'm a resident of Vancouver, and I'm speaking
[04:03:31] ▶in favor.
[04:03:33] ▶Downtown Vancouver
[04:03:34] ▶is still in recovery.
[04:03:36] ▶We talk constantly about revitalization,
[04:03:39] ▶about foot traffic,
[04:03:41] ▶small business survival,
[04:03:42] ▶and keeping economic activity in the core of Vancouver.
[04:03:46] ▶Yet when it comes to regulated
[04:03:49] ▶entertainment capacity,
[04:03:51] ▶we hesitate.
[04:03:52] ▶Gambling revenue in British Columbia is already substantial,
[04:03:56] ▶and it is administered by the British Columbia Lottery Corporation. The demand exists. The spending exists.
[04:04:03] ▶The question is where that economic activity occurs.
[04:04:07] ▶Right now,
[04:04:08] ▶downtown has one major venue, Park Vancouver.
[04:04:12] ▶When it reaches capacity, especially after major events at Rogers Arena,
[04:04:18] ▶that spending leaves the downtown core.
[04:04:21] ▶It goes to other municipalities.
[04:04:22] ▶It goes online. It leaves restaurants, taxis, hotels,
[04:04:26] ▶and surrounding businesses without the spillover benefits.
[04:04:31] ▶300 additional machines are not about
[04:04:34] ▶expanding gambling culture. They're about capacity.
[04:04:37] ▶They're about keeping dollars circulating in Vancouver's economy.
[04:04:42] ▶More in person activity means
[04:04:45] ▶more hospitality jobs,
[04:04:47] ▶more foot traffic for nearby businesses,
[04:04:50] ▶more
[04:04:51] ▶municipal revenue,
[04:04:52] ▶and stronger post event economic retention.
[04:04:56] ▶If we are serious about downtown vibrancy,
[04:05:00] ▶we cannot ignore the economic ecosystem around regulated entertainment venues.
[04:05:06] ▶The demand is already here.
[04:05:09] ▶The spending is already happening.
[04:05:11] ▶The question is whether Vancouver captures it
[04:05:15] ▶or sends it elsewhere.
[04:05:17] ▶Thank you for your time. I really appreciate it.
[04:05:19] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you for calling in this evening. Our next speaker is speaker number 24, Bruno Clapsey.
[04:05:26] ▶Is Bruno here in person?
[04:05:30] ▶Oh, just coming in.
[04:05:36] ▶Good evening, Bruno. You're gonna be using the podium over here to my your left, my right.
[04:05:41] ▶Speaker 3: Good
[04:05:42] ▶evening,
[04:05:44] ▶madam chairman,
[04:05:47] ▶councilors,
[04:05:49] ▶ladies and gentlemen.
[04:05:50] ▶My name is Bruno Clapsy.
[04:05:53] ▶I live in Coquitlam, but I have a place in Vancouver.
[04:05:58] ▶Regarding casino tonight when I came in,
[04:06:01] ▶I,
[04:06:02] ▶was quite surprised.
[04:06:04] ▶Not really surprised. I was just
[04:06:06] ▶I was, expecting
[04:06:09] ▶sugar and honey about,
[04:06:12] ▶casino.
[04:06:13] ▶That's the reason I put a hat on so you don't see my hair standing up.
[04:06:20] ▶I I was thinking about benefits for a casino.
[04:06:23] ▶Then I thought,
[04:06:25] ▶there's no reason
[04:06:27] ▶for me to think about it. Only few years ago,
[04:06:31] ▶it was all in the paper.
[04:06:33] ▶What benefit we get from casino?
[04:06:37] ▶Well, that's what I said.
[04:06:39] ▶They said,
[04:06:40] ▶they're praying on Wallerboom.
[04:06:44] ▶They money launderer
[04:06:47] ▶with
[04:06:48] ▶bags,
[04:06:49] ▶$20 bills,
[04:06:53] ▶and my drug dealers in casinos,
[04:06:57] ▶the hurting cohesion
[04:07:00] ▶of certain families.
[04:07:03] ▶So these were the benefits, if you think a lot of good benefits. I don't think and and it's all in newspapers. It's not coming out of my head. It's all in newspapers. If you go back, might be five or six years, it's all in the newspapers.
[04:07:19] ▶Who will benefit?
[04:07:21] ▶All the council get a little bit more money for the, you know, for the taxes and all that.
[04:07:27] ▶And maybe
[04:07:29] ▶the casino will give some money
[04:07:32] ▶to
[04:07:33] ▶to charities
[04:07:34] ▶so they can get,
[04:07:37] ▶better better
[04:07:39] ▶return on their tax dollars.
[04:07:42] ▶And and the rest of the money
[04:07:44] ▶that is
[04:07:45] ▶the the way does it goes, it goes into
[04:07:48] ▶oligarchs' pockets.
[04:07:54] ▶Not not the ordinary people. Not the ordinary.
[04:07:57] ▶It would be better if you rent
[04:08:00] ▶that space to some associations,
[04:08:03] ▶a reasonable rent.
[04:08:05] ▶That would do more for the community than casinos.
[04:08:16] ▶I was thinking about also I was thinking about,
[04:08:20] ▶but, my my heritage and,
[04:08:23] ▶and and why I'm here. And, and I said, there must be pretty good people,
[04:08:28] ▶my heritage, because I'm here now.
[04:08:31] ▶Because only two thousand years ago,
[04:08:35] ▶in the land of Israel,
[04:08:37] ▶they condemned
[04:08:38] ▶the
[04:08:39] ▶the gambling.
[04:08:41] ▶There's no different today.
[04:08:43] ▶We are the same people. We don't need to raise our ears
[04:08:46] ▶and drink to our eye. We are still the same people.
[04:08:49] ▶So if my
[04:08:52] ▶heritage or my forefathers thought gambling is no good
[04:08:56] ▶at that time, what might I think is good now?
[04:09:01] ▶I don't think so.
[04:09:15] ▶I I don't have much to say. The only thing I have to say that
[04:09:19] ▶I oppose
[04:09:21] ▶the casino,
[04:09:24] ▶an expansion
[04:09:26] ▶on the beliefs that I already mentioned.
[04:09:29] ▶And another thing I say,
[04:09:32] ▶why do we want more casinos? We got enough casinos now.
[04:09:37] ▶We might as well put at the border,
[04:09:40] ▶welcome to Las Vegas.
[04:09:43] ▶We don't need the Illinois casino. We got enough casinos.
[04:09:47] ▶Thank you for your time.
[04:09:49] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much for coming in this evening.
[04:09:51] ▶Our last registered speaker, speaker number 25, Steven Boas.
[04:09:56] ▶Hi. Can you hear me? Yes. We can. Go ahead, Steven. Okay.
[04:10:00] ▶Speaker 38: Thank you. Good evening, council, and thank you for this opportunity to speak. I live in Vancouver, and I'm opposed to the casino expansion.
[04:10:08] ▶I'm in solidarity with the Unite Here for the locals opposition, and I stand with the chief medical officer in opposition.
[04:10:16] ▶I was here actually in the council chambers, to the day,
[04:10:21] ▶fifteen years ago and spoke against proposed casino expansion
[04:10:25] ▶at that time. And I actually thought that the debate on the casino expansion was completely settled. There was, like, widespread opposition.
[04:10:33] ▶There seems to be a loss of institutional memory, and the staff assigned to this rezoning were unfortunately not available or not around at that time for the previous casino battle because,
[04:10:43] ▶a lot of the things are coming up again.
[04:10:45] ▶But back in 2011, there was no there was an in person open house or staff presentations. There was a q and a. And now there was this, mere low key online only consultation that really didn't capture a lot of the feedback.
[04:10:58] ▶And I actually don't believe that the due process has followed in the change to the moratorium on the casino expansion back in 2024 because a a staff report
[04:11:07] ▶relaying a request from the BCLC was put on the council agenda.
[04:11:12] ▶There wasn't a proper consultation back then, and that was a significant change and, related to this moratorium. So I think we
[04:11:19] ▶that was already,
[04:11:20] ▶not done properly.
[04:11:22] ▶But, since 2011,
[04:11:24] ▶important research about the role of casinos and money laundering was released. And, this includes, Sam Cooper's book, Willful Blindness.
[04:11:32] ▶That's now in multiple editions, and I've read, the book. And I would highly recommend that counsel read Willful Blindness first before making a decision because of your key key information in there.
[04:11:43] ▶As the previous speaker noted, Park may be actually considering flipping the property and the increase in the number of slot machines
[04:11:50] ▶could be used to increase possible sales value.
[04:11:54] ▶Park has fallen behind on payments at Citi, and I think that's that's really key in terms of looking at how well this, like, partnership has gone and hasn't gone very well.
[04:12:04] ▶Gambling doesn't really benefit communities. It tears them apart. The harms and addiction
[04:12:10] ▶far outweigh any gains.
[04:12:12] ▶Casinos enable money laundering.
[04:12:15] ▶As a previous speaker noted, the slot machines specifically target Chinese seniors in
[04:12:21] ▶the pickups,
[04:12:22] ▶by their buses and the advertising.
[04:12:24] ▶It exploits vulnerable residents,
[04:12:27] ▶and it actually sucks money out of the pockets of Vancouver residents. It's not a net gain. It's it's a net loss.
[04:12:34] ▶So it's not worth it. Some people lose everything. The house always wins, and Vancouver ends up losing.
[04:12:41] ▶So,
[04:12:42] ▶any, increase in the slot machine,
[04:12:45] ▶count will increase harms.
[04:12:47] ▶And, we actually really need to limit
[04:12:50] ▶the the ability of gambling and not expand it. So, for the reasons that I stated in in 2011 and opposing this casino and everything that we know since then,
[04:13:01] ▶it was a really big mistake to allow the relocation of the casino, to allow casino to be built, to allow for,
[04:13:08] ▶floor space for additional slot machines, which shouldn't have been permitted under development permit phase.
[04:13:14] ▶And now we're back here debating,
[04:13:17] ▶expanding this casino. Council, please turn this down. It's an election year. This should go to the electorate
[04:13:23] ▶and it should be turned down. There was a widespread
[04:13:26] ▶consensus against the casino across all the parties
[04:13:29] ▶back in 2011. So please, vote no. Thank you. Thank you, Steven, for calling in this evening.
[04:13:36] ▶Speaker 33: That brings us to the end of our registered speakers list, but I am going to check and see if there's any additional speakers in chamber. I understand that we may have a speaker in person. Faye Talla.
[04:13:47] ▶Are you here?
[04:14:02] ▶You're gonna be using the podium to your your left and my right.
[04:14:08] ▶And just a reminder, you need to note if you're a resident of Vancouver and if you're speaking in favor of opposition.
[04:14:14] ▶Speaker 58: I'm a resident of Vancouver.
[04:14:17] ▶Good good evening, mayor and council.
[04:14:20] ▶My name is Faye Thala. I am a resident of City Of Vancouver.
[04:14:24] ▶I'm opposed of to this proposal.
[04:14:27] ▶We don't need expanded gambling
[04:14:29] ▶that
[04:14:30] ▶enriches
[04:14:31] ▶private investors
[04:14:33] ▶while increasing
[04:14:35] ▶social harms for our community.
[04:14:37] ▶ARC reports that they intend to focus on gamblers first, which means increasing revenue
[04:14:44] ▶from comms gamblers.
[04:14:48] ▶Does that mean that the rest of us will have to shoulder the burden
[04:14:52] ▶of greater social impacts related to addiction and crime.
[04:14:57] ▶About five percent of players with problem gambling generate
[04:15:00] ▶one third of gambling
[04:15:02] ▶revenues in BC.
[04:15:05] ▶Where some of those problem gamblers,
[04:15:07] ▶people with low incomes, and seniors over the age of 65
[04:15:11] ▶are disproportionately
[04:15:14] ▶at risk.
[04:15:16] ▶The city
[04:15:17] ▶report estimates
[04:15:19] ▶that another 6,000
[04:15:21] ▶future part patrons
[04:15:23] ▶could be at risk of problem gambling
[04:15:26] ▶if expansion is approved at park.
[04:15:30] ▶In the city,
[04:15:31] ▶going to settle
[04:15:33] ▶for nickels and dimes,
[04:15:35] ▶while park makes million of
[04:15:38] ▶of more problems,
[04:15:39] ▶gobblers.
[04:15:41] ▶We shouldn't give away so much to parks, owners with so little in return.
[04:15:47] ▶Vancouver
[04:15:48] ▶residents
[04:15:49] ▶told council some years back that they didn't want to seek expansion of gambling in the city because
[04:15:56] ▶of the social harms that come with it.
[04:15:59] ▶Why
[04:16:01] ▶is council ignoring
[04:16:03] ▶what the people wanted? Instead, council allowed this proposal
[04:16:07] ▶to come forward anyway.
[04:16:10] ▶I think the cause of
[04:16:12] ▶outweigh the benefits and and I urge you to vote no.
[04:16:17] ▶Thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak tonight.
[04:16:21] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you for your comments this evening.
[04:16:23] ▶Are there any other, speakers in chambers or out in the lobby?
[04:16:27] ▶Yeah. I'll come up to the podium, please, and just, state your name, if you're a resident or if you're in favor of opposition.
[04:16:34] ▶Speaker 59: Thank you. My name is Angela Brain. I was resident of Vancouver for thirteen thirteen years.
[04:16:40] ▶Just lived just outside of Vancouver, but I still own a rented property in Vancouver.
[04:16:46] ▶I'm here to speak in support of the application while recognizing our team of more than 700 casino professionals
[04:16:53] ▶who provide a safe and welcoming environment
[04:16:56] ▶for both residents and visitors in Vancouver.
[04:17:00] ▶Many of Parr Casino's associates have worked five to thirty years at Parrk or previous casinos in Vancouver.
[04:17:09] ▶We have a vested interest in maintaining a healthy, long term relationship with residents, businesses,
[04:17:15] ▶sports teams, and charities in our community.
[04:17:19] ▶Pat Davis from BCLC
[04:17:21] ▶spoke about Vancouver residents who choose to play slots in neighboring cities
[04:17:26] ▶that offer almost twice as many slot machines.
[04:17:30] ▶Five Lower Main Mainland casinos have from 920
[04:17:34] ▶to 1,300
[04:17:35] ▶slot machines.
[04:17:36] ▶Park Casino will still have fewer slot machines than those five casinos,
[04:17:43] ▶but will be able to offer more choices
[04:17:46] ▶to those residents that choose to visit other casinos because their favorite machine
[04:17:52] ▶may be taken or may not be available when they choose to visit.
[04:17:56] ▶Our casino is unique with its location downtown due to surges of visitors after arena events.
[04:18:03] ▶We attract many sports fans and concert goers
[04:18:07] ▶through our complimentary
[04:18:08] ▶amenities, such as multiple restaurants,
[04:18:10] ▶lounges, and hotels on-site.
[04:18:13] ▶Park Casino is a place to meet and connect before going to arenas and a place to continue the fun after events.
[04:18:21] ▶Many of these post event visitors and tourists are interested in slot machines,
[04:18:26] ▶but on these busy event nights, they might not be available because of the surge in gas
[04:18:31] ▶and there isn't any selection.
[04:18:33] ▶We see this as a missed opportunity.
[04:18:37] ▶If approved, the city will benefit from both the increased host government share of gaming revenues,
[04:18:43] ▶in addition to a 50% increase in the social responsibility
[04:18:48] ▶fund contributions.
[04:18:49] ▶The social responsibility
[04:18:51] ▶fund, which is also unique to the city of Vancouver,
[04:18:55] ▶it increased from 200,000
[04:18:58] ▶when it was the previous Edgewater Casino
[04:19:01] ▶to, $600,000
[04:19:03] ▶annually when Park opened its doors,
[04:19:06] ▶in September 2017.
[04:19:09] ▶The payments were paused
[04:19:12] ▶when the casino was closed for sixteen
[04:19:14] ▶months during COVID.
[04:19:17] ▶During this time, Park earned no gaming revenue, and many of our employees were not able to work.
[04:19:24] ▶But after the casino reopened,
[04:19:26] ▶city council approved a payment plan in July
[04:19:30] ▶2022
[04:19:32] ▶where a 100%
[04:19:33] ▶of the $600,000
[04:19:35] ▶annual social responsibility
[04:19:37] ▶payments would still be paid.
[04:19:40] ▶Park Casino has followed through with that agreement
[04:19:43] ▶to honor its commitment.
[04:19:47] ▶So just in closing, just like to say thank you for the opportunity
[04:19:51] ▶to express support of the application, and thank you for everyone with an interest in expressing their their comments. They are heard. Thank you.
[04:19:59] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you for your comments this evening. Are there any other speakers in chambers or in the lobby
[04:20:04] ▶on this item?
[04:20:07] ▶Seeing none,
[04:20:09] ▶I'm gonna check if there's anyone online.
[04:20:16] ▶Speaker 1: No additional speakers on the line.
[04:20:19] ▶Speaker 33: Okay. In that case, I'll do our final call for speakers. If you wish to speak to counsel on this item, please call toll free +1 (833)
[04:20:26] ▶353-8610,
[04:20:29] ▶followed by participant code 1061445Pound.
[04:20:33] ▶The phone number will be posted on x and displayed during the recess. We will now take a two minute recess for any additional speakers to call in or come forward to the podium.
[04:20:43] ▶We'll be back at 10:22,
[04:20:44] ▶council. Thanks.
[04:23:26] ▶Welcome back, counsel.
[04:23:29] ▶Oh, we'll just hang on.
[04:23:50] ▶K, counsel.
[04:23:53] ▶Clerk, do we have any speakers in chamber or on the line?
[04:23:57] ▶I'll check.
[04:24:02] ▶Speaker 0: We do not, chair.
[04:24:04] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you. In that case, I'm gonna close,
[04:24:06] ▶the speaker's list.
[04:24:09] ▶Do we have a large volume of public comments received on this item since 5PM?
[04:24:14] ▶Speaker 1: There has been around 15 pieces of correspondence received since 5PM.
[04:24:18] ▶Speaker 33: K.
[04:24:19] ▶Council, in light of that, does council need a brief recess to review the additional comments that have been sent in? We have had additional correspondence since,
[04:24:29] ▶5PM, 15 pieces.
[04:24:31] ▶Does everyone does council need additional need five minutes to review it?
[04:24:38] ▶Checking in? Not hearing so? Okay.
[04:24:41] ▶In that case, I'm gonna close receipt of public comments.
[04:24:49] ▶Does the applicant have any closing comments?
[04:24:54] ▶K. Thank you.
[04:24:56] ▶Do staff have any closing comments? No comments. Thank you.
[04:24:59] ▶Thank you.
[04:25:01] ▶Counsel, any further and final questions to, staff, noting we can't ask questions to the applicant at this time, just to staff.
[04:25:09] ▶I see, councilor Zhou on the queue. Go ahead, councilor Zhou. Yeah. Thanks, chair. So, some additional question to our staff.
[04:25:16] ▶Speaker 0: So if this report is passed,
[04:25:19] ▶what is cost to the city running this, expansion?
[04:25:22] ▶The cost? Yeah. The city? Mhmm. No cost. No cost. Okay. And, also, for the additional revenue generated from the expansion,
[04:25:29] ▶it's going to the city's general revenue or to some specific revenue?
[04:25:34] ▶Speaker 41: That is a good question. I'm gonna look yeah. Go ahead.
[04:25:38] ▶Speaker 42: It goes to general revenue. The 10% from the host financial assistance agreement goes to general revenue. Okay. So that means city can use that revenue as city priority to go to whichever,
[04:25:47] ▶Speaker 0: whichever areas. That's correct. Art and culture,
[04:25:50] ▶housing, anything. Yes. That's correct. Thank you.
[04:25:53] ▶Another question to our city staff is, if in the future, say, five years, ten years, whatever, so city wanna revisit this decision.
[04:26:01] ▶Can we roll back this expansion?
[04:26:06] ▶Speaker 41: That is a good question. I thought you would answer like, ask if there's another expansion. I would have said there is another rezoning.
[04:26:12] ▶Yes.
[04:26:14] ▶Speaker 12: Back. Yeah. Back. Back,
[04:26:17] ▶Speaker 41: looking over to my
[04:26:19] ▶boss over there,
[04:26:21] ▶taking taking back the decision they make today in the future
[04:26:26] ▶without
[04:26:27] ▶like, a city initiated rezoning
[04:26:29] ▶would, in theory, be possible. But
[04:26:37] ▶Speaker 0: Oh, that's okay. Yeah.
[04:26:39] ▶Speaker 41: Yeah. That's okay, Josh. It's in the bylaw. Right? Like, the the slot machines are written in the city one bylaw. And in order to change that, there would have to be a rezoning again.
[04:26:48] ▶Speaker 0: And, you you know, it's As for the expansion, but going back.
[04:26:56] ▶Do you wanna you wanna tell them? Okay. Apparently, you can. I I just heard. So that's possible. You could take back that. So that means in the future council, like, the council decide there's a unintended consequence because of the expansion today. So there's a possibility we can, remedy those, this expansion, this decision tonight.
[04:27:15] ▶Speaker 41: I I understand. That's true. Yes. Okay. Thank you.
[04:27:19] ▶Speaker 0: The last question is,
[04:27:21] ▶so council approved this, removal of, maritime in 2024.
[04:27:26] ▶Why it takes two years to get us for this expansion request? Why such a long time?
[04:27:32] ▶Speaker 41: We received this application in
[04:27:35] ▶06/04/2026,
[04:27:37] ▶and this is not a standard rezoning. Usually, text amendments take about six months. 2025?
[04:27:41] ▶2025. What did you say? 2025.
[04:27:44] ▶And,
[04:27:45] ▶and usually, it takes half a year to do a text amendment, but this
[04:27:49] ▶this one is really complicated because it's a Gaming Control Act application plus a rezoning. So we need to figure out the process and make sure we do the right amount of consultation and engagement, and so that took us a while to to figure out the right process. Okay. So we received the application June 2024 or '24. '5. Twenty twenty twenty five. Yeah. So it took less than one year, six six months Yes. To get us today, which is faster than A little bit more than six months. Yeah. But Yes. The amendment. Yes. Yes. Okay. Thank you. That's all my question. Thanks, chair.
[04:28:19] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, councilor.
[04:28:20] ▶I'm just gonna advance myself. I have a quick question.
[04:28:23] ▶I can't ask this to the applicant now, but,
[04:28:26] ▶noting,
[04:28:28] ▶you know, there's been both by the applicant and by speakers,
[04:28:31] ▶note that,
[04:28:34] ▶interested in in in person
[04:28:36] ▶gambling gaming has gone down. There's much more access online.
[04:28:41] ▶Do you have a sense of, if this was supported this evening, how quickly,
[04:28:46] ▶the intention would be for Park City to install
[04:28:49] ▶the new slots. And,
[04:28:51] ▶because and I'm I'm I know it's not the same as, dealing with applications that come here for development, but we have approved,
[04:28:58] ▶I don't know, how many rezonings.
[04:29:00] ▶And then years later, a site is empty and vacant. There's nothing happening and and for market reasons. So I'm just curious what kind of conversations you had with the applicant.
[04:29:09] ▶Speaker 41: From conversations, we learned that, they're they're intending to do it as soon as possible. But because slot machines need to be ordered and it's quite, a large number, that might take a while. And,
[04:29:20] ▶that's also why we staggered the payments because that's the amount
[04:29:24] ▶until they think they have the full amount of slot machines ready, which will be in 2028,
[04:29:29] ▶and they'll see the full amount of revenues
[04:29:32] ▶going in. So they'll they'll start, but it's gonna take some time to install and and do the changes
[04:29:38] ▶and renovations and whatnot is necessary.
[04:29:41] ▶Speaker 33: Okay. Thank you. I'll leave it there. I see councilor Orr in the queue. Go ahead, councilor Orr. Yeah. I just wanna revisit,
[04:29:47] ▶Speaker 8: an answer that you gave to, councilor's
[04:29:49] ▶question on,
[04:29:51] ▶costs. There's
[04:29:52] ▶I mean,
[04:29:54] ▶there is there is increased costs
[04:29:56] ▶Well, not in terms of
[04:29:58] ▶Speaker 41: If you if you like, not in our revenue, but, like, if you will, the harm and, like, other consequences
[04:30:03] ▶that I can't answer that question. Social social costs being one
[04:30:07] ▶Speaker 8: that we heard from from,
[04:30:10] ▶from,
[04:30:11] ▶Mark,
[04:30:12] ▶decision, but,
[04:30:14] ▶like, policing costs too.
[04:30:16] ▶Fire,
[04:30:18] ▶2,067
[04:30:20] ▶Speaker 41: police calls. According to,
[04:30:22] ▶our our talks fire calls. I'm sorry for interrupting here. Okay.
[04:30:27] ▶According to our,
[04:30:30] ▶conversations with VDP, they say they don't expect a lot of,
[04:30:35] ▶expansion of those calls. They saw,
[04:30:38] ▶an expansion after
[04:30:39] ▶the the casino opened and it receded after, and they might expect
[04:30:44] ▶a very small hump. But they said, like, percentage wise, they don't expect a lot of Okay. So there are some costs?
[04:30:51] ▶Speaker 8: There might be. K. Thanks. Well, for my questions.
[04:30:55] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you. Is that it, counselor Orr, or did you have further Yeah. That's all my question. Okay. Thank you. I don't see any counselors on the queue for further questions. I will check.
[04:31:04] ▶Just check-in with the clerks to see if there's any additional public comments since the close of public comments.
[04:31:17] ▶Thank you. Just a moment.
[04:31:30] ▶Speaker 13: No. There are not.
[04:31:32] ▶Speaker 33: Okay. Thank you, clerks.
[04:31:34] ▶In this okay. In this case, then,
[04:31:37] ▶we'll move to decision. Can I get someone to move the recommendation?
[04:31:40] ▶Moved by councilor Zhou. May I get a seconder?
[04:31:44] ▶Seconded by councilor Claassen.
[04:31:46] ▶We'll now move into discussion.
[04:31:48] ▶If you wish to speak, please put yourselves on the queue. I see councilor Frey. Go ahead, councilor Frey.
[04:31:56] ▶Speaker 7: Yeah. Thanks, chair. I've, submitted
[04:31:59] ▶a motion to refer
[04:32:01] ▶to the clerks.
[04:32:04] ▶Of course. Maybe.
[04:32:07] ▶Speaker 33: Councilor Frey, we're just gonna get that amendment pulled up so everyone can see it and the public as well. Sure. And I'll I'll I'll just I'll just read it out,
[04:32:14] ▶Speaker 7: in the preamble.
[04:32:15] ▶So, it's that, CD one
[04:32:19] ▶five nineteen text amendment and gaming control act approval
[04:32:22] ▶39 To 65 Smythe Street be referred back to staff
[04:32:26] ▶to report back with further health impact assessment,
[04:32:30] ▶HIA analysis,
[04:32:32] ▶pending the report and consideration of recently commissioned studies, the BC gaming policy and enforcement branches
[04:32:38] ▶household prevalence survey
[04:32:40] ▶and StatsCan
[04:32:42] ▶Canadian community health survey, both of which are expected in spring and fall of this year, respectively.
[04:32:49] ▶In in putting this forward, I think that we've we've heard that there are some some gaps in the analysis,
[04:32:55] ▶here and indeed in the in the report.
[04:32:58] ▶And and I do point to the existing,
[04:33:01] ▶problem gambling
[04:33:02] ▶severity index data that that BC Lottery Corporation collects by surveying 500 players
[04:33:08] ▶per quarter
[04:33:09] ▶who are, attending casinos,
[04:33:12] ▶in the in the Lower Mainland. And I and
[04:33:15] ▶I think we have,
[04:33:16] ▶you know, with the proximity and with the understanding that there are,
[04:33:20] ▶I I do know anecdotally and from observation that there are a number of of,
[04:33:25] ▶East Asian seniors that that gamble and that don't seem to be captured or named as high risk gamblers,
[04:33:31] ▶and that both of these studies are addressing, I think, some of those those concerns and
[04:33:36] ▶providing us with,
[04:33:39] ▶important data to reflect on the health impacts of gambling and in in particular vulnerable problem populations
[04:33:46] ▶that it would be prudent to,
[04:33:48] ▶to refer that back pending the these,
[04:33:51] ▶reports that are coming from
[04:33:53] ▶the provincial government and stats count respectively.
[04:33:56] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, councilor. I'll need a seconder.
[04:33:58] ▶Councilor Maloney? That's seconded by councilor Maloney.
[04:34:01] ▶We're now in an amendment queue. Council, if you wish to debate the amendment, and just to be clear, it is a referral back to staff.
[04:34:08] ▶Please put yourselves on the queue.
[04:34:11] ▶Counselor
[04:34:12] ▶Speaker 8: go ahead, counselor Orr. Yeah. I like this, amendment.
[04:34:15] ▶For sure. I think it's prudent and responsible.
[04:34:18] ▶I don't think we need to rush this,
[04:34:21] ▶decision, and it's our job to make, data driven,
[04:34:26] ▶choices here. So I will support. Thanks.
[04:34:30] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, councilor.
[04:34:33] ▶That concludes our speakers on this, so I will call the vote. And, again, this is a an amendment as a referral,
[04:34:39] ▶back to staff. Please vote on online, and clerks all probably need a vote assist,
[04:34:46] ▶in opposition. Thank you.
[04:34:53] ▶And,
[04:34:54] ▶council, that fails,
[04:34:56] ▶with myself, councilor Kirby Young, councilor Montague, councilor Klassen, councilor Meisner, councilor Zhou in opposition.
[04:35:07] ▶Thank you. Okay. That brings us back to,
[04:35:10] ▶the staff recommendation.
[04:35:12] ▶Councilor Frey, do you have anything further?
[04:35:15] ▶Don't. Thanks, Cheryl. K. Thank you, councilor Frey.
[04:35:19] ▶So we're back to the main queue. Councilor Maloney, go ahead.
[04:35:23] ▶Thanks. Yeah.
[04:35:25] ▶Speaker 46: Unfortunately, I've seen governments in other parts of the world become increasingly dependent on gambling revenues to pay for government general expenditure,
[04:35:34] ▶and this dependence
[04:35:36] ▶stood in the way of effective action to mitigate the serious social harms caused by problem gambling in vulnerable groups.
[04:35:44] ▶I do find it hard to accept that we're doing enough to prevent problem gambling
[04:35:49] ▶when a casino
[04:35:50] ▶has an absence of views to the outdoors and
[04:35:54] ▶from slot machines and
[04:35:56] ▶has twenty four seven operating hours.
[04:36:00] ▶I mean, our supermarkets aren't open twenty four seven.
[04:36:05] ▶I I understand that some people think what's the point when people can access online gambling, but I don't think that failures to regulate on online gambling give us an excuse for
[04:36:17] ▶to for us to shrug our shoulders and,
[04:36:20] ▶give up. And I don't see,
[04:36:23] ▶evidence that this expansion
[04:36:26] ▶will reduce the harms of online gambling.
[04:36:30] ▶I also heard that there's nowhere else to go, nothing else or and nothing else to do after an event at Rogers
[04:36:37] ▶Arena finishes. I think we need to work to give people other options.
[04:36:41] ▶I think there's nothing stopping this business or any other from expanding
[04:36:46] ▶non gambling attractions,
[04:36:49] ▶to attract and accommodate patrons. So I'll be, voting against this.
[04:36:56] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, councilor Maloney.
[04:36:57] ▶Councilor Orr, go ahead. Yeah. I just,
[04:37:00] ▶Speaker 8: kinda echo those sentiments. I think we need to be really cautious about expanding gambling in our city.
[04:37:05] ▶Increasing increasing the number of slot machines,
[04:37:08] ▶will generate revenue, but it exposes our most vulnerable residents,
[04:37:12] ▶especially older adults and low income people.
[04:37:15] ▶And noting in the staff report, it said roughly five percent of players with problem gambling generate
[04:37:21] ▶about one third of that revenue. Players with incomes under 40,000
[04:37:26] ▶are the second highest risk group for problem gambling. We did a disproportionate
[04:37:30] ▶financial and health impacts
[04:37:31] ▶on residents least able to absorb financial losses, and that mitigation
[04:37:36] ▶cannot fully offset the underlying risks.
[04:37:39] ▶So what we're saying is that it's kind of okay if a few vulnerable people are targeted if that means increased revenue.
[04:37:47] ▶Data also showed that the age group most prone to problem gambling was the 65
[04:37:51] ▶age group, and that has risen in years.
[04:37:54] ▶We have to be careful about
[04:37:56] ▶comparing this to harm reduction of drug users as one counselor alluded. Harm reduction
[04:38:02] ▶of drugs hard drugs is not a revenue source. They don't advertise it to tourists as an attraction. Its main goal is to simply keep people alive and prevent disease.
[04:38:11] ▶Harm reduction for illegal drugs operates in opposition to criminal justice systems that penalize use. Harm reduction for gambling exists within legal regulated industry where operators have a duty to generate profit
[04:38:22] ▶while also discouraging overconsumption.
[04:38:26] ▶So,
[04:38:27] ▶it's much more like our approach to alcohol. Slots are not the same as our toxic drug supply and to say otherwise is very dangerous.
[04:38:35] ▶I think this is also underlined by the fact that park has shifted to a casino first approach, which targets problem gambler gamblers. The staff report says if approved, the expansion may expose additional people to elevated risk of potentially long lasting gambling related harm based on research plus possible
[04:38:51] ▶indirect impacts to others, increased demand for health and social services. We heard about the increased amount of policing calls around park. We heard about a pattern of overstated
[04:39:00] ▶projections and declining revenues. We heard about the health impacts
[04:39:03] ▶from our expert here, suicide, addiction, family issues, theft, bankruptcy,
[04:39:08] ▶and that is overrepresented in marginalized communities.
[04:39:11] ▶And despite mitigation, harms don't just affect the gambler.
[04:39:15] ▶About six other people are are also affected.
[04:39:19] ▶And we heard that specific numbers weren't provided by this facility, that there's not a great accounting of harms
[04:39:25] ▶versus,
[04:39:26] ▶accounting of benefits.
[04:39:28] ▶No data on the success of mitigation.
[04:39:30] ▶How many like, for how many suicides has has this prevented. So I just think that this really increases the likely likelihood of harms.
[04:39:38] ▶I don't think the community benefits offset these social costs,
[04:39:42] ▶and I I think we should have waited for the report.
[04:39:45] ▶And but,
[04:39:47] ▶we that was defeated, so I I I oppose this expansion. Thanks.
[04:39:52] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, councilor, for your comments. Councilor Frey, go ahead.
[04:39:57] ▶Speaker 7: Yeah.
[04:39:57] ▶Thanks. I
[04:39:59] ▶you know, we we heard, quite a few references tonight to,
[04:40:04] ▶the,
[04:40:05] ▶emergence of of of,
[04:40:07] ▶phone games and and that kind of
[04:40:10] ▶new new new approach to online gambling. And and indeed, that is a prevalent thing, and I think that that we live in extraordinary times. And we know that,
[04:40:18] ▶like, social media,
[04:40:19] ▶like,
[04:40:20] ▶trading,
[04:40:22] ▶cybercurrencies,
[04:40:23] ▶and indeed,
[04:40:24] ▶you know, online gambling, These are all driven by complex
[04:40:28] ▶new systems with algorithms
[04:40:30] ▶and, and designs that that that pull people in with deep immersion. There's structural features with with the lights and the sounds and the bells and the whistles and and and feedback loops that are that are moving people into this more disassociative
[04:40:44] ▶trance like state,
[04:40:45] ▶where they lose track of their time and their surroundings.
[04:40:48] ▶And and this is technological
[04:40:50] ▶advancements that are that are are are gripping people and bringing them into to
[04:40:55] ▶the the world of of
[04:40:56] ▶of specifically slot machine type gambling. Now I love the park casino as a as a as a destination place.
[04:41:03] ▶Beautiful designs, lovely room. I don't gamble myself, but I do recognize that we are entering a new era of of these kind of high intensity,
[04:41:13] ▶reward systems in slot machines that are incredibly addictive.
[04:41:17] ▶And we know that this this ratio of risk and reward,
[04:41:21] ▶is being
[04:41:24] ▶gamed, if you will, to to to to grab people in with this sort of near miss engineering and the kind of technology that gets people hooked in so close and so close.
[04:41:33] ▶And and I worry that, you know, this this sort of almost one
[04:41:37] ▶dopamine spike kind of,
[04:41:41] ▶approach to to winning gamblers over and and and hooking them,
[04:41:46] ▶is a tough one to justify. And I think that we know that this new technology that is new technology and is emerging in the last couple years
[04:41:54] ▶is is reason enough for us to pause to have the expert analysis
[04:41:58] ▶from,
[04:42:00] ▶the the provincial and federal agencies that are looking at what does problem gambling look like in 2026,
[04:42:07] ▶and not based on incomplete data from different sources, I think is is critical and important
[04:42:12] ▶if we are gonna, you know, pursue what we just recently passed as far as a healthy city and those kind of strategies that we are rightly proud of, as far as what guides our city decision making, but I think we're we're missing that in this analysis. And that, for me, is a mistake to approve.
[04:42:30] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, councilor Frey.
[04:42:31] ▶Councilor
[04:42:32] ▶Speaker 0: Zhou. Yeah. Thanks, sir. I'll just keep my comments,
[04:42:35] ▶brief because we'll have a long night.
[04:42:37] ▶You know, I just wanna respond to one of the comments from a councilor seeing that, government is is increasingly
[04:42:43] ▶rely on the money from the gambling industry. I found this pretty funny because of this expansion only generate 1.3
[04:42:50] ▶additional million,
[04:42:51] ▶million dollars additional. And we're talking about more than $2,000,000,000
[04:42:56] ▶city's, city's,
[04:42:57] ▶budget every year. So I found $1,300,000
[04:43:00] ▶is a very small portion. So I just don't buy that argument. The government rely on the money from the gambling industry.
[04:43:06] ▶And and, also, I think, I feel I I I feel there's some fearmongering about,
[04:43:11] ▶this expansion. It's we are not building a brand new casino.
[04:43:14] ▶And, you know, even with the increase, the number of, slot machine
[04:43:19] ▶in the, this location is still much less than Burnaby, Richmond, even.
[04:43:24] ▶So, and, also, what what we heard tonight, we have very, very robust gambling addiction
[04:43:29] ▶programs. And, also, the additional revenue,
[04:43:32] ▶will help us reinvest into those programs to
[04:43:36] ▶to help us, support a lot of nonprofit organizations.
[04:43:40] ▶So I think it's not a vote tonight about whether gambling is perfect or not. It's not. Absolutely not.
[04:43:46] ▶But it's a it's a vote about whether we should regulate
[04:43:50] ▶gambling
[04:43:51] ▶thoughtfully just like we regulate,
[04:43:54] ▶cannabis and other industry.
[04:43:56] ▶So I think the expansion
[04:43:58] ▶makes sense to me because it it is paired with increased contributions,
[04:44:02] ▶strengthened agreements,
[04:44:04] ▶ongoing monitoring, and also public transparency,
[04:44:07] ▶and also the ability for council to revisit this decision for future.
[04:44:12] ▶And also, you know, just to be clear, reject this proposal would not eliminate gambling. It will not. But it will reduce our leverage.
[04:44:20] ▶It will weak weaken our ability
[04:44:23] ▶to attach conditions on this regulation.
[04:44:25] ▶So I like to support this expansion because I wanna support,
[04:44:29] ▶the 14 jobs
[04:44:31] ▶created by this expansion
[04:44:32] ▶and the mainly unionized positions.
[04:44:35] ▶I'm thinking about these 14 families.
[04:44:37] ▶They have a a consistent income benefit from this expansion. So I'm thinking about them. I wanna support them. I wanna support small small business because with this expansion, there will be additional revenues for the small business, which is already in a very tough economic situation right now. And I also, I wanna support nonprofit organizations.
[04:44:56] ▶As with with what we heard tonight, there are 50 nonprofit organization in the city of Vancouver
[04:45:01] ▶benefit from this,
[04:45:02] ▶social and the community benefit program. And and also, you know, because of our responsibility,
[04:45:08] ▶gaming agreement and also the, financial assistant agreement, a lot of,
[04:45:13] ▶you know, nonprofit profit organizations
[04:45:16] ▶and the staff will will be beneficial from that. So with that, I I wanna support this expansion. Thanks, chair.
[04:45:23] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, councilor Zhou.
[04:45:25] ▶I don't see anyone else on the queue to speak.
[04:45:28] ▶In that case, I'm gonna call the vote.
[04:45:31] ▶Thank you everyone for having your cameras online. If you are voting, you do need to be visible.
[04:45:37] ▶Just a reminder.
[04:45:38] ▶And, please vote online.
[04:45:49] ▶I'll take a vote. Assist in favor, please.
[04:46:02] ▶Thank you. Thank you, clerks.
[04:46:04] ▶So that passes with myself, councilor Montague, councilor Claussen, councilor Meisner, and councilor Zhou in favor.
[04:46:12] ▶Oh, and sorry. My apologies. Councilor Bly, councilor Frey, councilor Orr, and councilor Maloney in
[04:46:17] ▶position. Thank you, council. That concludes,
[04:46:21] ▶item number two.
[04:46:23] ▶I'll make space one minute for people to clear the room, and then we'll move on to item number three.
[04:46:35] ▶K. So we are gonna move on to,
[04:46:38] ▶item three, which is CD1899
[04:46:40] ▶text amendment
[04:46:42] ▶33603384
[04:46:44] ▶Venice Avenue
[04:46:46] ▶and 3347
[04:46:48] ▶Clive Avenue.
[04:46:50] ▶Just wanna make sure I have a form here.
[04:46:53] ▶We can confirm form.
[04:46:57] ▶Before it begins item, does anyone have believe they have a conflict of interest?
[04:47:02] ▶Hearing none, the clerk will now read the application and summary of correspondence received to date.
[04:47:08] ▶Speaker 6: This is an application by Intracorp Projects Limited to amend CD one district eight nine nine by law number 14333
[04:47:17] ▶or 33603384
[04:47:20] ▶Vanessa Avenue and 3347
[04:47:22] ▶Clive Avenue
[04:47:24] ▶to increase the maximum floor space ratio from 11.38
[04:47:28] ▶to 11.52,
[04:47:29] ▶increase the proportion of below market rental housing from 10%
[04:47:34] ▶to 20%
[04:47:35] ▶of the residential floor area, and convert the previously secured city owned childcare into commercial space are proposed.
[04:47:43] ▶The general manager of planning, urban design, and sustainability
[04:47:46] ▶recommends approval
[04:47:47] ▶subject to conditions set out in the summary and recommendations.
[04:47:51] ▶Since the following correspondence has been received since referral to public hearing, one piece of correspondence in support,
[04:47:58] ▶12 pieces of correspondence in opposition,
[04:48:01] ▶and one piece of correspondence dealing with other aspects of the application.
[04:48:05] ▶This represents all correspondence received up to 5PM today.
[04:48:09] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, clerks. This is the first call for speakers. If you wish to speak to counsel about this item, please call toll free +1 (833)
[04:48:16] ▶353-8610
[04:48:18] ▶followed by the participant code 1061445.
[04:48:24] ▶The phone number will be displayed on x as well as displayed during the recess.
[04:48:28] ▶There will be an opportunity for new speakers and missed speakers to be heard at the end of the registered speakers list. We have staff from planning, urban design, and sustainability here to present the application.
[04:48:41] ▶Speaker 12: Good evening, madam council.
[04:48:44] ▶My name is Oscar Erickson, and I'm the rezoning planner for this text amendment application for 3360
[04:48:50] ▶To 3384
[04:48:51] ▶Vanessa Avenue and 3347
[04:48:54] ▶Clive Avenue.
[04:48:57] ▶The site outlined in red is located on the South side of Vanessa Avenue, just west of Joyce Collingwood Station.
[04:49:04] ▶The surrounding neighborhood consists of a mix of high, mid, and low density residential buildings with the greatest height located near the intersection of Joyce Street and Vanessa Avenue.
[04:49:16] ▶The enabling rezoning policy for this site is the Joyce Collingwood Station precinct plan.
[04:49:21] ▶In 2014, when the plan was adopted,
[04:49:24] ▶staff did not anticipate the site, here shown in red, to be redeveloped,
[04:49:28] ▶and the plan does not provide guidance on height and density.
[04:49:34] ▶The original rezoning application was approved by council in January
[04:49:38] ▶2024
[04:49:39] ▶and consisted of a two tower development connected by six story podium,
[04:49:44] ▶a building height up to 33 stories at 11.38
[04:49:47] ▶FSR.
[04:49:49] ▶The proposal included 679
[04:49:51] ▶market rental units
[04:49:52] ▶with 10% of the residential floor area secured at below market rates,
[04:49:57] ▶commercial uses at grade, and a 37 space turnkey childcare facility to be delivered in kind to the city.
[04:50:06] ▶The Joyce Collingwood Station precinct plant identified
[04:50:09] ▶a need for affordable housing and childcare care in the area.
[04:50:13] ▶In reviewing the application, staff considered the delivery of rental units, the below market rental units, and the and the childcare facility in relation to the plan's public benefit strategy
[04:50:24] ▶and recommended approval of the proposal, which exceeded the anticipated
[04:50:28] ▶height and density.
[04:50:30] ▶Council approved the application, and the CD one bylaw was enacted in May 2025.
[04:50:38] ▶In October 2025, the city received an application to amend CD one eight nine nine to increase the proportion of below market rental rental units from 10%
[04:50:48] ▶to 20% of the residential floor area,
[04:50:52] ▶adding approximately 68 below market rental units.
[04:50:56] ▶Convert the previously secured 37 space city owned childcare to commercial space, which allows for private childcare,
[04:51:03] ▶and to increase the maximum density from 11.38
[04:51:06] ▶to 11.52
[04:51:08] ▶FSR.
[04:51:11] ▶While no changes are proposed to the form of development, the amendment would result in an apparent increase in density.
[04:51:17] ▶This increase arises from the conversion of the former childcare space to commercial use, which would now be included in the floor area calculation.
[04:51:29] ▶A virtual q and a period was held in January 2026.
[04:51:33] ▶Support was expressed for the contribution to the housing stock
[04:51:37] ▶and the increase in below market rental units.
[04:51:40] ▶Concern was expressed for the loss of public amenity,
[04:51:44] ▶neighborhood impact, and traffic.
[04:51:48] ▶In response,
[04:51:50] ▶staff note that while the loss of the turnkey city owned childcare facility is regrettable,
[04:51:55] ▶affordable rental housing remains a top priority for the city, and 68 additional below market rental units was considered in lieu of childcare.
[04:52:04] ▶Regarding neighborhood impact,
[04:52:06] ▶the proposed text amendment does not increase the floor area of the development.
[04:52:10] ▶The total number number of approved rental units remains unchanged from the original 2024
[04:52:16] ▶approval.
[04:52:18] ▶The proposed change is not expected to result in measurable impacts on traffic congestion or safety.
[04:52:23] ▶The development's density as originally approved in 2024
[04:52:27] ▶aligns with the city's objective to support higher density residential development in close proximity to Sky
[04:52:35] ▶Train
[04:52:36] ▶stations.
[04:52:37] ▶The rezoning application that was approved in 2024
[04:52:40] ▶included development contributions totaling $16,300,000
[04:52:45] ▶It included 611
[04:52:47] ▶market rental units,
[04:52:49] ▶approximately 68 below market rental units, and an in kind childcare.
[04:52:53] ▶If the amendment is approved, the expected development cost levies and public art contribution for the project is estimated to be reduced to 7,000,000.
[04:53:03] ▶The reduction is due to the applicant now being eligible for the class a waiver of the citywide DCLs on the residential floor area and reductions to the DCL payments through the development viability report adopted by council in December.
[04:53:17] ▶Under the amended proposal,
[04:53:19] ▶the number of below market rental units would double in exchange for removing the in kind childcare facility.
[04:53:26] ▶In summary, if the amendment is approved, the project will deliver an additional 68 below market rental units for a total of 136
[04:53:34] ▶below market rental units.
[04:53:37] ▶The previously secure in this previously secured in kind childcare facility is removed from the proposal, and there will be a reduction in the estimated DCL contributions.
[04:53:47] ▶Staff have reviewed the pro product pro form a and confirmed that the value of securing the additional below market rental units is comparable to the value associated with the originally
[04:53:56] ▶proposed childcare facility and and other corresponding changes to the valuation.
[04:54:04] ▶In conclusion,
[04:54:05] ▶this proposed amendment advances the city's rental housing targets by delivering an additional 68 below market rental units.
[04:54:13] ▶Staff recommend approval subject to the conditions outlined in appendix b of the report.
[04:54:18] ▶Staff and applicant team are available to answer questions.
[04:54:21] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you. Thank you for the presentation.
[04:54:24] ▶Would the applicant like to make a presentation? Yes, please.
[04:54:29] ▶Speaker 5: Thank you very much, acting mayor and council.
[04:54:31] ▶We do really appreciate the opportunity to speak to you today. I know it's, it's been a long night for everyone, but we really appreciate it.
[04:54:38] ▶My name is Farooq Beboel, and I'm vice president of development at Intercorp Homes.
[04:54:42] ▶I wanna be acknowledged staff and council for its ongoing commitment to rental housing and complete
[04:54:47] ▶communities.
[04:54:49] ▶We share in that goal at Intercorp, and we greatly appreciate the time and care that's gone into preparing and reviewing this text amendment.
[04:54:56] ▶Intercorp has been working for nearly six years to advance the project towards construction readiness.
[04:55:03] ▶All permits are now in place. However, as council knows, entitlement alone does not guarantee delivery,
[04:55:09] ▶and many approved rental projects are currently stalled
[04:55:13] ▶due to financing
[04:55:14] ▶constraints.
[04:55:16] ▶Products of this scale and complexity are increasingly difficult to finance conventionally,
[04:55:21] ▶particularly amid today's economic uncertainty,
[04:55:24] ▶and they require coordinated support from all levels of government.
[04:55:28] ▶To that end, we applied to CMHC under the apartment construction loan program, which is the federal government financing program for large scale rental housing projects.
[04:55:38] ▶Initially, our application was,
[04:55:41] ▶initially, our application mirrored the approved rezoning.
[04:55:44] ▶However, this did not secure enough points to for a competitive framework.
[04:55:48] ▶CMHC
[04:55:49] ▶encouraged us to reapply
[04:55:51] ▶because they saw a greater potential in this project
[04:55:54] ▶with the opportunity to strengthen the application through deeper affordability.
[04:55:58] ▶In response to feedback, we updated and resubmitted the application.
[04:56:02] ▶These revisions resulted in conditional approval for the project.
[04:56:06] ▶Notably, this was the only project in BC to receive approvable to receive approval in this funding cycle, highlighting the strength and significance of this proposal.
[04:56:17] ▶The amendment before council today is intended to align the city's rezoning framework with CMHC's underline with CMHC's underwriting.
[04:56:25] ▶The overall public benefit value remains the same. However, it reallocate
[04:56:30] ▶the value in a way that better meets a federal mandate.
[04:56:33] ▶The form of development remains unchanged.
[04:56:37] ▶Specifically, the amendment doubles the below market rental requirement from 10% to 20% of the residential floor area.
[04:56:44] ▶To support the increase in affordability,
[04:56:46] ▶the previously proposed turnkey
[04:56:48] ▶city owned child care is now being contemplated as privately delivered.
[04:56:53] ▶Importantly,
[04:56:54] ▶the child care remains part of the proposal
[04:56:57] ▶and is now proposed as owned as commercial,
[04:57:00] ▶and this is consistent with how privately delivered child care is treated in the city of Vancouver.
[04:57:06] ▶Ultimately, the amendment provides the pathway for the project to proceed.
[04:57:10] ▶Without it, the financing cannot be secured and the construction cannot begin.
[04:57:15] ▶To reiterate, the amendment does not reduce the public benefit.
[04:57:19] ▶It is about enabling
[04:57:20] ▶delivery in today's challenging financial environment.
[04:57:24] ▶We respectfully request the support of council so that this important rental housing can proceed.
[04:57:29] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much. Thank you for your comments.
[04:57:33] ▶Council, do you have any questions,
[04:57:35] ▶for staff or the applicant? Just noting again, this is the only time to ask questions of the applicant. I just see people in the queue. Go ahead, councilor Kirby Young. Yeah. Thanks. This is an,
[04:57:45] ▶Speaker 9: an interesting one in terms of an intersection of a number of different policies,
[04:57:49] ▶and sort of the economic environment. So just to be clear, and this is a question of the applicant,
[04:57:56] ▶the we often hear,
[04:57:58] ▶from industry that the cost for delivering the BMR is a significant impact on the pro form a, and you've traded essentially,
[04:58:06] ▶you've essentially doubled that, but traded the $9,600,000
[04:58:09] ▶in DCLs. Is it the financing that is really the distinction in terms of the beneficial rate that
[04:58:17] ▶Speaker 5: that you would secure? Correct. So as part of the CMAC financing,
[04:58:18] ▶the production financing as well as the takeout financing is secured at construction,
[04:58:22] ▶and it is more favorable.
[04:58:24] ▶Additionally, as part of the pro form a analysis that we submitted to the city, there's actually no net change in public benefit, and our pro form a analysis actually showed a DCL waiver as part of that.
[04:58:34] ▶Speaker 9: Okay. So you wouldn't have been able to proceed.
[04:58:37] ▶Well, there might not you you arguably, staff could debate, and then I can follow-up with staff.
[04:58:42] ▶So the value of the amenity package between the DCL and the BMR was the financing that was the crux. Correct.
[04:58:48] ▶Correct. And if conventional financing had lent you at a comparable rate, you could have continued as So the equity requirement for conventional financing would just be too onerous for us to proceed. Too significant.
[04:58:58] ▶Okay. And then also following up to the applicant, when you say,
[04:59:02] ▶that the childcare is contemplated as privately delivered, does that mean what does that mean? Does that mean an intention to,
[04:59:09] ▶Speaker 5: It is our, full attention to deliver the childcare as part of the development. We see that there's value to the community as well as our project.
[04:59:17] ▶Childcare in privately
[04:59:19] ▶private childcare in the city of Vancouver is commercial space,
[04:59:22] ▶and that's how it's always intended to be.
[04:59:24] ▶And the space has been designed to accommodate a private childcare operator, including the outdoor space, which is forms part of the development permit. Okay. So you're designing it, you're fitting it out, and you're seeking It would be a shell space on the interior subject to, like, getting a childcare operator closer to occupancy.
[04:59:40] ▶But as part of the development permit permit, the exterior space, which is required to support the interior programming, is being provided as part of the application.
[04:59:48] ▶Speaker 9: Okay. And are you securing
[04:59:49] ▶lessees to
[04:59:51] ▶closer to occupancy, we would be securing an operator. Okay. And then what if you don't secure a private operator?
[04:59:58] ▶Speaker 5: It's our intention to secure an operator. The site like, the location of the of the proposed childcare supports a childcare. It's been designed as such. It actually has very limited frontage along it has no frontage along, the main street, and it's actually been designed to support the city programming. So it's our, like, full intention to,
[05:00:17] ▶seek a private operator closer to occupancy. Okay. So you saw this as a way to continue to deliver the childcare in a different It's not about eliminating the childcare from the project, but it's about delivering it as a private childcare rather than a public.
[05:00:29] ▶Speaker 9: Okay. Thank you.
[05:00:31] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, councilor.
[05:00:33] ▶Councilor,
[05:00:34] ▶advance you so that I'll go last. Oops. Sorry. Didn't do that. There you go.
[05:00:40] ▶Go ahead, councilor.
[05:00:41] ▶Speaker 8: Okay.
[05:00:43] ▶Yeah. Just a question on is it on for staff, just around a policy around
[05:00:49] ▶there's no real policy,
[05:00:52] ▶am I correct, in converting city owned
[05:00:56] ▶or in kind day care to to a sort of commercial?
[05:01:00] ▶There's no, like, policy on the books that, like, regulates that, or it's just sort of up to this discretion of counsel? Or
[05:01:13] ▶Speaker 12: Yeah. This is all regulated. Thanks for the question. This is all,
[05:01:17] ▶regulated through our our our c a CAC policy and how it's negotiated.
[05:01:22] ▶And as this was a negotiated,
[05:01:25] ▶approach in the first approval,
[05:01:27] ▶we have the flexibility of of of making changes to it.
[05:01:30] ▶Speaker 8: Okay. I see. And then,
[05:01:33] ▶for the commercial childcare, is there any kind of requirements for, like, security of tenure or security of tenure kind of thing? Like, is it
[05:01:41] ▶that might be a question for both of you, but
[05:01:44] ▶in terms of how long this will be remain a a childcare?
[05:01:48] ▶Speaker 12: So I can but just start explaining from the city perspective.
[05:01:51] ▶The way we handle these, private childcare
[05:01:55] ▶is that, it's it's it's it's
[05:01:58] ▶general commercial space,
[05:02:00] ▶and and it can be available for child care if there's an operator, or it can be used for other commercial needs. In this case, the applicant has an attention, and and the applicant speak speak to that. That's correct.
[05:02:12] ▶Speaker 5: The space has been designed to accommodate a child care as well as the provision of the exterior space as well.
[05:02:18] ▶In the city of Vancouver, private child care is zoned as commercial. Mhmm. And that's the reason that there's an increase in FSR as part of the application.
[05:02:25] ▶It's very much our intention to deliver that space,
[05:02:28] ▶as a private child care. I just would caution that our financing laps at the end of March, and so conditioning the project with further legal requirements,
[05:02:38] ▶such as securing that space as a private childcare would essentially jeopardize our our financing from proceeding.
[05:02:43] ▶Speaker 8: Interesting. Okay. Thanks.
[05:02:46] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you. I just have a quick question to staff.
[05:02:50] ▶Just could you just clarify for me just in your presentation, you're referring to
[05:02:54] ▶the class a waiver of DCLs.
[05:02:57] ▶Is that directly connected to and just refresh for me. Is that connected to the increase in below market,
[05:03:05] ▶units, delivering more below market units?
[05:03:08] ▶Speaker 12: Yes. That's correct, counselor.
[05:03:10] ▶The requirement for the class a DCL waiver is 20% BMR, and that's exactly what the applicant is sitting here. Okay. And then there's the CMH financing that was spoken to earlier. Okay. Thank you for clarifying that for me.
[05:03:22] ▶Speaker 33: Appreciate that.
[05:03:24] ▶Seeing no one else on the queue for questions at the time. At this time, I'm gonna do our second call for speakers.
[05:03:30] ▶If you wish to speak to council about this item, please call toll free +1 (833)
[05:03:35] ▶353-8610
[05:03:38] ▶followed by participant code 1061445Pound.
[05:03:43] ▶That number will be noted on x as well as, on the displayed on screen during the recess.
[05:03:48] ▶We will now hear from the public. Any speakers in the council chamber, please come forward to the left podium when it's your turn. That's the one here to my right. Phone in speakers will be unmuted when it's their turn. Speakers have up to five minutes to make their comments and should limit their comments to the merits of this, application.
[05:04:04] ▶Our first registered speaker is Mona Stilwell.
[05:04:16] ▶Welcome, Mona.
[05:04:20] ▶Speaker 61: Hey. I'm really tired.
[05:04:22] ▶I'm a mom.
[05:04:24] ▶Thanks for hanging in there. And I had to, do a lot of cleaning because today's Chinese New Year.
[05:04:33] ▶My name is Mona Stilwell. I'm a resident of Renfrew Collingwood,
[05:04:37] ▶and I have a story. It's a quick one.
[05:04:39] ▶I had twins.
[05:04:41] ▶They were born,
[05:04:42] ▶and I immediately worried about childcare.
[05:04:45] ▶I was warned
[05:04:47] ▶to, like,
[05:04:48] ▶sign up
[05:04:50] ▶as soon as they were born. In fact, when they were still in utero.
[05:04:53] ▶And
[05:04:54] ▶and it was really concerning.
[05:04:58] ▶We ended up having to hire a private nanny because twins
[05:05:01] ▶cost more. And we ended up getting into childcare. So thankful they both got into the same one. Can you imagine if I had to go to two different daycares?
[05:05:11] ▶Crazy.
[05:05:13] ▶But finding childcare is
[05:05:17] ▶it's a really
[05:05:18] ▶stressful, emotional
[05:05:21] ▶thing for families that they have to think through just because they want to get
[05:05:25] ▶k. Let me read my thing. K. I oppose this amendment because I see a day I see on a day to day basis in my neighborhood, Collingwood,
[05:05:34] ▶Renfrew, that families are struggling to live in our beautiful city, and this amendment does not help those most in need.
[05:05:41] ▶Vancouver has a deep shortfall of childcare spaces.
[05:05:44] ▶Converting the city sponsored childcare space to a private one
[05:05:48] ▶is a risk because
[05:05:51] ▶I I'm personally concerned
[05:05:53] ▶that if the space is not snatched up by private child care space, it's gonna be converted into a regular commercial space.
[05:05:59] ▶And then we've lost 37 spots
[05:06:02] ▶for families to
[05:06:04] ▶to be covered
[05:06:06] ▶for women, women's health to be, you know,
[05:06:09] ▶sorry. I'm so tired.
[05:06:11] ▶Okay.
[05:06:12] ▶Doing great.
[05:06:16] ▶Below market housing. I know this sounds so good. Yay. A 120,
[05:06:20] ▶below market housing items
[05:06:22] ▶and, or units,
[05:06:27] ▶but
[05:06:28] ▶it's not enough. That is not affordable housing.
[05:06:32] ▶I know there's, like, different
[05:06:33] ▶monikers for different things like affordable housing, low market. I know all these things are not my wheelhouse, but I just know it's different. And I know it's an
[05:06:44] ▶it's not accessible housing.
[05:06:47] ▶So although it sounds good,
[05:06:50] ▶it's not accessible,
[05:06:51] ▶especially for those folks living in my neighborhood.
[05:06:54] ▶Every week, I go to the,
[05:06:56] ▶I don't know why I'm crying, free pantry,
[05:06:59] ▶and I load it up. And the next day I show up, I'm like, oh, there's probably gonna be tons left. It's entirely empty after I filled it up.
[05:07:08] ▶And it just breaks my heart that there are even though it looks like, you know, suburban area,
[05:07:13] ▶people are struggling. Families are struggling. Child care
[05:07:17] ▶really helps. City
[05:07:19] ▶sponsored
[05:07:20] ▶child care, especially, is so important for those families that are struggling.
[05:07:26] ▶Engagement.
[05:07:27] ▶I wanted to say that
[05:07:30] ▶I I I didn't hear about this engagement
[05:07:32] ▶personally, not that that matters,
[05:07:35] ▶but I felt like there should have been a more fulsome
[05:07:39] ▶attempt at engagement with the community.
[05:07:42] ▶11 I think there was 11
[05:07:45] ▶folks that
[05:07:46] ▶answered the survey.
[05:07:49] ▶That is not enough. I'm sorry. Maybe people were busy. Maybe it was Thanksgiving. I don't know what, but
[05:07:55] ▶I think a greater effort
[05:07:57] ▶should have been made.
[05:07:59] ▶Also, I heard that,
[05:08:02] ▶Collinwood Neighborhood House,
[05:08:05] ▶it's a small organization.
[05:08:07] ▶People aren't paid super well. It's a nonprofit,
[05:08:10] ▶and they spent three weeks working with the applicant
[05:08:15] ▶originally
[05:08:16] ▶to
[05:08:17] ▶figure out the childcare spacing.
[05:08:20] ▶And
[05:08:20] ▶all they got when they found out that there was this new amendment was a simple email, and I felt that that was really disrespectful.
[05:08:28] ▶You know, when you ask people to do some huge project off the side of their desk, I'm sure we've all had that experience.
[05:08:35] ▶I'm like, oh, great. My full time job plus, I gotta do this extra thing. And then to have that disrespected, I felt like that was that sounded not great to me. Okay.
[05:08:44] ▶We're
[05:08:45] ▶we are entering the year of the fire horse.
[05:08:48] ▶It's a year of rapid movement, action, and consequences.
[05:08:51] ▶These consequences come really quickly.
[05:08:54] ▶The last time the fire horse came around,
[05:08:57] ▶the CPP was born,
[05:08:59] ▶or medical care assist act was set up, and there was a cultural revolution in China.
[05:09:07] ▶Things are changing,
[05:09:08] ▶and we think you have the power to make such important and,
[05:09:13] ▶impactful changes to the community that I live and I love. Thank you so much for your time. Thank you, Mona, and thanks for hanging in there.
[05:09:22] ▶Speaker 33: Gonna move to our speaker number two, Devin Harlows.
[05:09:31] ▶Speaker 62: Hello, mayor and council. My name is Devin Harlows. I live near the project site in Collingwood.
[05:09:36] ▶And before becoming a mom a few months ago, I was a registered professional planner with the Planning Institute of British Columbia.
[05:09:42] ▶I'm not opposed to this project, but I am strongly opposed to this amendment before you.
[05:09:48] ▶Not only from a personal perspective, as my family needs the affordable childcare in this development,
[05:09:54] ▶but more importantly, there are major ethical and fiduciary issues with this amendment.
[05:09:59] ▶If approved, council council would be failing to uphold the delivery of a $7,750,000
[05:10:06] ▶community amendee contribution
[05:10:08] ▶that is legally owed by Inc IntraCorp
[05:10:11] ▶and upon which your zoning approval in 2024
[05:10:14] ▶was predicated.
[05:10:16] ▶Just two years ago, council approved a density increase from point six and one point four five FSR
[05:10:22] ▶to 11.38
[05:10:23] ▶FSR.
[05:10:24] ▶This massive increase in density was contingent
[05:10:28] ▶on the developer delivering a turnkey city owned childcare on the Main Floor,
[05:10:32] ▶died at $7,750,000
[05:10:34] ▶and a cash CAC of $500,
[05:10:37] ▶a total of 8,250,000
[05:10:39] ▶in public benefits.
[05:10:41] ▶During that rezoning process, members of the public were told
[05:10:45] ▶at the online open house, at the in person engagement sessions,
[05:10:49] ▶at on the shape your city website, by the 3,800
[05:10:52] ▶notifications that went out and by planning staff, that the city was securing a childcare
[05:10:59] ▶in exchange for the increase in density.
[05:11:01] ▶And council's approval in 2024
[05:11:04] ▶of the project was based on this exchange.
[05:11:07] ▶Now, just a year after enactment, the project is proceeding. The developer owns the land, the sites mobilized, demolition is underway.
[05:11:15] ▶We are being told that Intercorp has changed their financing model to CMHC,
[05:11:20] ▶and they'll only proceed with the project
[05:11:22] ▶if council abandons its obligation to the public in upholding its own CAC agreements.
[05:11:29] ▶Instead of coming to you with an amendment, the applicant should be working on alternative solutions to delivering this childcare.
[05:11:36] ▶Nowhere in the report does it demonstrate that efforts were made to explore alternative financing options
[05:11:43] ▶or capital grant opportunities
[05:11:45] ▶to fund the childcare construction.
[05:11:48] ▶This is done all the time in the nonprofit sector to fund the construction of community service space in rental projects that the housing programs won't finance.
[05:11:57] ▶Moreover, the CMHC program is in place to support the viability of rental housing,
[05:12:03] ▶not to incentivize stripping already approved pro projects
[05:12:08] ▶of necessary community infrastructure.
[05:12:11] ▶The argument that an additional 68 below market rental units is of equal value as the childcare space, and that this amendment is simply an exchange of value, does not hold in my opinion.
[05:12:22] ▶First, how can you make that determination
[05:12:25] ▶if you do not see those numbers in front of you outlined in the report?
[05:12:29] ▶And secondly, a childcare serves a completely different function
[05:12:34] ▶than rental units. A function that is desperately needed in this community.
[05:12:38] ▶That need informed this rezoning decision
[05:12:42] ▶and now it's irrelevant
[05:12:44] ▶with this amendment.
[05:12:46] ▶You also need to see that the public was sufficiently engaged on this substantial change. There was no public information session on this amendment,
[05:12:54] ▶and the notifications that were sent and the shape your city website stated incorrectly,
[05:12:59] ▶that the publicly owned childcare was converting to privately owned.
[05:13:03] ▶There is nothing requiring a childcare in this amendment.
[05:13:08] ▶It will be general commercial space.
[05:13:12] ▶Staff acknowledged this error and resent out the notifications and updated the city website.
[05:13:17] ▶However, they did this after the two week window for public engagement had already closed.
[05:13:24] ▶In my opinion, this is a procedural error and council therefore cannot rely on this report for a fair representation
[05:13:31] ▶of the public interest on this matter.
[05:13:34] ▶Another major issue is that an approval would taint future re go rezoning negotiations,
[05:13:39] ▶and set a dangerous precedent with developers.
[05:13:43] ▶How can a good faith negotiation take place, and how can the city successfully advocate for the public interest in negotiations,
[05:13:50] ▶if you demonstrate through this amendment that the city does not uphold what's legally agreed to at the rezoning stage.
[05:13:59] ▶Promise the public millions in in kind CACs, get the density approved, and then before construction
[05:14:05] ▶just ask for an amendment and you're off the hook.
[05:14:08] ▶In closing, if you approve this, you'll be undermining the rezoning process,
[05:14:13] ▶setting a precedent for bad faith negotiations,
[05:14:15] ▶canceling an affordable childcare that the developer is legally obligated to build, and breaching your fiduciary duties as counsel.
[05:14:23] ▶Speaker 33: This should be referred back to staff. Thank you. Thank you very much for your comments. Councilor, are you on for question to speaker? I'll just advance you. Go ahead, councilor. Can you repeat the part about,
[05:14:34] ▶Speaker 8: the procedural error?
[05:14:36] ▶Speaker 46: Yes.
[05:14:38] ▶I just didn't quite catch it.
[05:14:46] ▶Speaker 62: Okay. So,
[05:14:48] ▶the notifications
[05:14:49] ▶that were sent and the shape your city website stated incorrectly
[05:14:53] ▶that the publicly owned childcare was converting to privately owned.
[05:14:59] ▶There is nothing requiring a childcare in this amendment.
[05:15:02] ▶It'll be general commercial space,
[05:15:05] ▶and staff acknowledged this error and resent out the notifications
[05:15:08] ▶with the corrected,
[05:15:10] ▶wording
[05:15:11] ▶stating that it's converting to general commercial space and not a privately owned childcare.
[05:15:16] ▶But they sent that out after
[05:15:18] ▶the shape your city website had was open for comments and question and answers.
[05:15:24] ▶Okay. And they also did it after,
[05:15:28] ▶the referral report, which is dated January 20,
[05:15:31] ▶and the city website was updated on January 22, I believe. And then it'll received the updated notifications,
[05:15:38] ▶after that date as well.
[05:15:40] ▶Speaker 33: K. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks for clarifying that point.
[05:15:45] ▶Anything further, councilor? No. That's everything. Thank you. Thank you. Our next speaker is Allison Merton.
[05:15:52] ▶Speaker 28: Hello. Good evening. My name is Allison Merton.
[05:15:56] ▶I am the earliest director at Collingwood Neighborhood House in East Vancouver. I'm calling in tonight
[05:16:01] ▶with concerns on the application from the developer to open it for city owned childcare facility
[05:16:07] ▶and instead convert into a commercial space.
[05:16:11] ▶Collingwood was confirmed as a nonprofit childcare operator of Viness
[05:16:16] ▶in May 2025
[05:16:18] ▶after we had completed an extensive expression of interest,
[05:16:22] ▶one that included many, many hours of staff time and resources to prepare.
[05:16:27] ▶Collingwood has a forty year history in the Renfrew Collingwood community
[05:16:32] ▶of providing high quality,
[05:16:34] ▶accessible,
[05:16:35] ▶affordable childcare to our community.
[05:16:38] ▶We currently operate 397
[05:16:40] ▶child care spaces in nine locations,
[05:16:43] ▶three delivered in city owned facilities,
[05:16:46] ▶one in partnership with Bright side Homes,
[05:16:48] ▶and five school age programs located in our local elementary schools.
[05:16:53] ▶A 183
[05:16:54] ▶of our under six childcare spaces are 10 a day.
[05:16:58] ▶This development was designed with 37 childcare spaces
[05:17:02] ▶to accommodate the anticipated number of families.
[05:17:06] ▶However, our community
[05:17:08] ▶has now a thousand families on waiting lists, highlighting
[05:17:11] ▶a significant need for additional spaces.
[05:17:15] ▶Our understanding is that there are no new projected sites in the near future for child care in the Renfrew Collingwood community.
[05:17:23] ▶It has been over thirteen years since we had the opportunity to partner with the city to create new child care spaces,
[05:17:30] ▶so we were excited to have the chance to offer more child care in our neighborhood.
[05:17:35] ▶Imagine our dismay to find out after
[05:17:38] ▶the amount of focus time to complete the application,
[05:17:42] ▶this may no longer be the case.
[05:17:45] ▶As a neighborhood house, we know it's a fine balance to meet all the community's needs.
[05:17:50] ▶Both affordable housing and childcare are important.
[05:17:54] ▶The Renfrew Collingwood community needs both.
[05:17:58] ▶Although this commercial space will still be childcare,
[05:18:01] ▶it will be a for profit childcare operator.
[05:18:05] ▶It would not deliver the public not for profit spaces
[05:18:09] ▶the city should be prioritizing
[05:18:11] ▶and would instead only provide access to families
[05:18:15] ▶who can afford to pay high fees.
[05:18:18] ▶This does not align with the city's goal of creating affordable
[05:18:21] ▶and accessible child care.
[05:18:25] ▶As a neighborhood house, we provide wraparound services for the whole family that supports social determinants of health. We support families to live their best lives and become citizens that contribute to the community and the city.
[05:18:39] ▶In fact, because Collingwood Neighborhood House has been a part of this community for forty years, we now have staff who once attended our childcare programs themselves.
[05:18:47] ▶During interviews, I hear time and again that they want to return to the neighborhood,
[05:18:52] ▶driven by the deep sense of belonging
[05:18:54] ▶and connection they form through the neighborhood housing experience there.
[05:18:59] ▶That's our mission,
[05:19:00] ▶a place to belong, a place to grow.
[05:19:03] ▶Our neighborhood is a place of connection, belonging, and inclusion.
[05:19:08] ▶As we heard today, the province has reached a pivotal moment for child care.
[05:19:13] ▶We believe the city must uphold its commitments to partner with community organization and non profits
[05:19:19] ▶to plan for accessible,
[05:19:21] ▶affordable,
[05:19:22] ▶and high quality child care,
[05:19:24] ▶ensuring that children, families,
[05:19:26] ▶and our broader community can learn, work, and thrive.
[05:19:30] ▶We remain deeply committed and will continue our advocacy to the mission of providing affordable, accessible, and high quality child care in Renfrew Collingwood.
[05:19:39] ▶Our community deserves this.
[05:19:42] ▶We would like council to consider the impact of parents and children
[05:19:46] ▶to the community and to the neighborhood health.
[05:19:49] ▶Thank you all for your time tonight.
[05:19:51] ▶Speaker 33: Allison, can you just stay on the line for a moment?
[05:19:54] ▶Yes. Yes. Thank you. It's Kelsey Domnetta. I just have a quick question for you. If and I don't know if you're willing to speak to this. Are are is,
[05:20:03] ▶Collingwood still in any active conversations with Intercorp about the the commercial space?
[05:20:10] ▶Speaker 28: No. We actually found out through an email from, the city,
[05:20:15] ▶that the developer had put in an application. That's how we found out about this amendment.
[05:20:20] ▶Speaker 33: K. And and I'm recognizing I I appreciate the role and work of neighborhood houses, but,
[05:20:25] ▶is there
[05:20:27] ▶beyond being not for profit,
[05:20:29] ▶is there anything that precludes you from exploring,
[05:20:32] ▶that commercial space,
[05:20:34] ▶for delivery of childcare by the neighborhood house?
[05:20:37] ▶Speaker 28: Yeah. So it's a nonprofit organization. We just can't afford the commercial leases. That's why it's essential for us to partner with the city,
[05:20:45] ▶to develop and and deliver childcare.
[05:20:48] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much. Thanks for staying on the line.
[05:20:51] ▶Thank you. Thank you. Our next speaker is Melanie Chang.
[05:21:03] ▶Yeah. That podium. Go ahead.
[05:21:06] ▶Speaker 63: So,
[05:21:07] ▶I prerecorded my presentation.
[05:21:10] ▶I'm wondering if they can play it.
[05:21:13] ▶Speaker 33: Is, has it been delivered to clerks? Okay. Yeah. They're just getting all set up.
[05:21:46] ▶Speaker 63: Thank you, mayor and council. My name is Melanie Chang.
[05:21:49] ▶I oppose this text amendment, and I'm speaking on behalf of families in this area.
[05:21:53] ▶This project is blocks away from my home, and although it's a a project that is near to me, these issues affect the entire city.
[05:22:03] ▶The first reason I oppose this application is because of childcare.
[05:22:07] ▶The original
[05:22:08] ▶approval secured 37 spaces of city owned childcare
[05:22:13] ▶to honor the precinct plant and city targets.
[05:22:16] ▶The amendment removes that childcare,
[05:22:19] ▶discharges
[05:22:20] ▶that child care agreement on title, and converts that space to commercial use.
[05:22:25] ▶We are receiving significant density, which is welcomed,
[05:22:28] ▶but the child care that justified that density for families is being removed.
[05:22:33] ▶City owned space is essential
[05:22:36] ▶for viable to dollar a day child care, and there's no alternative space in the community where this
[05:22:42] ▶child care investment can be located.
[05:22:45] ▶In the city's making strides update, the target is to provide for 59%
[05:22:49] ▶of children to have access to full time childcare.
[05:22:53] ▶In order to hit that mark, we need 41 more 100 more spaces,
[05:22:57] ▶and the only way that we can get those spaces is through adding childcare
[05:23:02] ▶to rezoning applications
[05:23:05] ▶and not removing them like is proposed under this plan.
[05:23:10] ▶The developer is citing CMHC
[05:23:12] ▶funding policies to remove childcare from this plan.
[05:23:15] ▶However, the CMHC
[05:23:17] ▶apartment construction loan program
[05:23:20] ▶requires supporting community oriented solutions and working with partners.
[05:23:25] ▶Collingwood Neighborhood House, which was to be the nonprofit childcare operator, was not engaged
[05:23:31] ▶with the removal of the childcare spaces,
[05:23:34] ▶and the community was not consulted on alternatives.
[05:23:38] ▶The second reason I oppose this plan is because of the, community engagement.
[05:23:43] ▶The original CD1 rezoning
[05:23:45] ▶involved three months of consultation and input from
[05:23:49] ▶267
[05:23:50] ▶sources.
[05:23:51] ▶This amendment alters the key public benefits with limited invade engagement.
[05:23:56] ▶Notice cards were delivered over the Christmas period while the community was actively mobilized
[05:24:02] ▶around the the closure of Carleton Elementary, which is located just blocks away from this development.
[05:24:08] ▶Only 11 responses were received from more than 3,800
[05:24:12] ▶notices,
[05:24:13] ▶yet this amendment is proceeding.
[05:24:17] ▶The third reason why I oppose this application is because of the community amenity contributions.
[05:24:23] ▶In the original application, $500,000
[05:24:26] ▶was,
[05:24:28] ▶assessed for community amenity contributions.
[05:24:30] ▶In the tax amendment, staff determined that no additional CACs were required.
[05:24:35] ▶This is despite the material changes, including the removal of childcare obligations,
[05:24:41] ▶conversion of that space to commercial revenue,
[05:24:44] ▶the access for the developer for low cost CMHC financing,
[05:24:47] ▶and the $8,700,000
[05:24:50] ▶in DCL waivers.
[05:24:51] ▶Those changes have financial implications
[05:24:54] ▶on land lift and deserve transparent review of CACs.
[05:24:59] ▶The Auditor General emphasized transparency
[05:25:01] ▶in land valuation and public benefit calculations.
[05:25:05] ▶CACs are based on land lift, and when density or public benefits change, the financial assumptions should be transparently
[05:25:12] ▶reassessed.
[05:25:16] ▶The family mix policy requires 35%
[05:25:19] ▶of family units
[05:25:20] ▶defined
[05:25:21] ▶as two or three bedroom units.
[05:25:24] ▶So the the fourth reason that I oppose this application is that the project only
[05:25:29] ▶proposes
[05:25:30] ▶thirty one three bedroom units out of a total of 679
[05:25:35] ▶units.
[05:25:36] ▶City data shows that there's a chronic shortage of three bedroom rental units for families.
[05:25:42] ▶In 2024,
[05:25:44] ▶only 1.6%
[05:25:46] ▶of purpose built rental homes citywide have three bedrooms.
[05:25:50] ▶Parents in my community
[05:25:53] ▶have had to sleep in the living room to ensure that their kids have bedrooms,
[05:25:58] ▶and this is not okay.
[05:26:00] ▶We need housing for families.
[05:26:04] ▶In summary, our community has asked for counsel
[05:26:08] ▶here.
[05:26:09] ▶This amendment should not proceed
[05:26:12] ▶without protection
[05:26:13] ▶or alternative placement
[05:26:15] ▶of the secured childcare that was promised to us under the precinct plan.
[05:26:21] ▶This amendment should
[05:26:23] ▶require proper community consultation
[05:26:26] ▶and ensure that we have, sufficiently
[05:26:29] ▶engaged,
[05:26:30] ▶people in the changes.
[05:26:32] ▶We need a transparent
[05:26:34] ▶explanation of how the community amenity
[05:26:37] ▶contributions are calculated,
[05:26:39] ▶if there's any material changes in public benefits,
[05:26:43] ▶and, we need a strengthened three bedroom family unit supply
[05:26:47] ▶for our community and, to,
[05:26:50] ▶ensure that families in Vancouver have places to live.
[05:26:54] ▶So
[05:26:55] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you. And thanks for being here in person to support it. Thank you.
[05:27:00] ▶Our last speaker is Trevor Falconhagen.
[05:27:07] ▶Do I have Trevor on the line?
[05:27:12] ▶Speaker 45: Just checking, Cher.
[05:27:14] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you.
[05:27:16] ▶Speaker 5: Speaker six is not on the line.
[05:27:18] ▶Speaker 33: K.
[05:27:20] ▶Just gonna see if there's any other additional speakers in chambers that wish to speak to this item.
[05:27:28] ▶There any other speakers on the line?
[05:27:33] ▶Okay.
[05:27:34] ▶Speaker with the last four digits 7622.
[05:27:42] ▶Speaker 28: Hello?
[05:27:43] ▶Speaker 33: Hi. Can you,
[05:27:44] ▶state your name if you're a resident of Vancouver and whether you're in favor or in opposition to the text amendment this evening?
[05:27:51] ▶Speaker 15: Yes. Thank you so much,
[05:27:53] ▶chair and counsel and staff and everyone who's still there.
[05:27:57] ▶My name is Sarah McLeod. I I do live in Vancouver.
[05:28:03] ▶Also, just another thanks to the the the five speakers so far.
[05:28:08] ▶I am opposed to the text amendment.
[05:28:12] ▶The first speaker, Mona, mentioned,
[05:28:17] ▶the, like, the housing.
[05:28:19] ▶First of all, the trade off of the child care is a whole other thing that I'll get to. But just even that the housing trade off of it being more below market is still not affordable, and they said not accessible.
[05:28:32] ▶And
[05:28:33] ▶that's true.
[05:28:36] ▶The, you know, the new definition of affordability from a lot of these developers coming is, like, attainable as opposed to affordable now. Right? And all all of that to say, right, it's just all not accessible.
[05:28:46] ▶And then
[05:28:48] ▶the fact the fact that
[05:28:50] ▶thousand families are on a wait list for child care.
[05:28:53] ▶And, again, the first speaker related
[05:28:55] ▶to the the the find looking for child care to, like, even women's health.
[05:29:01] ▶And then the third speaker mentioning that this is an ethical issue
[05:29:06] ▶as well, and the last speaker even mentioning the fact that we have a shortage of three bedrooms being built. None of this promotes families.
[05:29:13] ▶None of it promotes health of families and women and childcare.
[05:29:18] ▶And,
[05:29:19] ▶I really
[05:29:21] ▶do believe I don't know what legal imperative means anymore because I've mentioned this,
[05:29:26] ▶at some rezonings and, I guess, text amendments,
[05:29:29] ▶seen, like, before you guys at council.
[05:29:32] ▶But I'll just read one section of,
[05:29:36] ▶the calls to justice,
[05:29:38] ▶you know, section 13
[05:29:40] ▶for development industries.
[05:29:42] ▶There's five recommendations,
[05:29:44] ▶and three of them mentioned municipal government. I'll read the fifth one because
[05:29:49] ▶I think you guys are lacking this in every single rezoning you're passing, and
[05:29:54] ▶it's how we will stop, you
[05:29:58] ▶know, gender based violence.
[05:30:01] ▶So it's that we call upon
[05:30:03] ▶development industries and all governments and service providers
[05:30:07] ▶to anticipate
[05:30:09] ▶and recognize
[05:30:10] ▶increased demand on social infrastructure
[05:30:13] ▶because of development projects
[05:30:16] ▶and for mitigation measures to be identified as part of the planning and approval process.
[05:30:22] ▶Social infrastructure must be expanded and service capacity built to meet the anticipated needs of the host communities in advance in advance of the start of projects.
[05:30:33] ▶This includes but is not limited to ensuring that policing, social services, and health services are adequately staffed and resourced.
[05:30:41] ▶I want us to leave and say that child care falls under social services.
[05:30:47] ▶Just even the one proposal, right, with over 600 units, If you take the average size or average amount of people that are in a unit in Vancouver at 2.6,
[05:30:57] ▶and you just make easy math and go for two because who's having kids. Right?
[05:31:01] ▶Because there's nowhere to have them go to school. But that's 1,200 people. And then if you were actually to count the point six and say that people are starting families in these units,
[05:31:11] ▶then that's over 400 kids.
[05:31:14] ▶So even at the beginning when it was guaranteeing 37 childcare units, like, was that really
[05:31:20] ▶using the words from the thing, anticipating and recognizing the increased demand
[05:31:25] ▶that of these social services?
[05:31:28] ▶And then just to cut it out completely is just absurd.
[05:31:33] ▶Please,
[05:31:34] ▶you know, take care of,
[05:31:36] ▶families in this city. And, thank you for letting me speak to you tonight.
[05:31:41] ▶Speaker 33: Thanks for calling in this evening, Sarah.
[05:31:43] ▶Speaker number six, Trevor Falkenhagen,
[05:31:45] ▶is on the line.
[05:31:49] ▶Speaker 60: Yeah. Hi there. Sorry about that. Hello. Yep. Hey. Good
[05:31:53] ▶good evening, counsel and mayor Sam, wherever you are. My name is Trevor Falkenhagen.
[05:31:58] ▶I am a new father and resident of the Renfrew Collingwood neighborhood,
[05:32:02] ▶walking distance from Joyce Collingwood Station.
[05:32:04] ▶I'm speaking tonight in opposition of the proposed text amendment,
[05:32:08] ▶which would remove the owner's obligation to provide a childcare facility.
[05:32:12] ▶This project underwent valuable community engagement
[05:32:15] ▶in order to increase the FSR
[05:32:17] ▶from 1.45
[05:32:19] ▶to 11.38.
[05:32:21] ▶Part of that agreement was that Intercorp would provide the city of Vancouver
[05:32:25] ▶and its residents with a childcare facility.
[05:32:28] ▶Now the owner has mobilized the site with demolition and abatement underway.
[05:32:32] ▶Why are we only finding out about this now?
[05:32:35] ▶Furthermore, the city of Vancouver has not been very transparent with its residents.
[05:32:39] ▶When initially posted to their website, it stated, and I quote,
[05:32:43] ▶convert the previously secured city owned childcare facility
[05:32:47] ▶to private ownership.
[05:32:49] ▶The website has since been updated and now somewhat reflects the reality of the situation
[05:32:54] ▶stating convert the previously secured city owned childcare
[05:32:57] ▶into commercial space
[05:32:59] ▶allowing for private child care.
[05:33:01] ▶However, when I walked by the site this morning, the posted signage still states false information saying there will be private child care. This is misleading to my neighbors who, after speaking with some of them, were still under the impression that a childcare facility
[05:33:15] ▶was gonna be delivered as part of this project based on the posted signage.
[05:33:19] ▶We were promised childcare in this neighborhood, and we need it urgently.
[05:33:23] ▶I, like many other residents, am struggling to find childcare for my daughter, and I'm already on numerous wait lists.
[05:33:29] ▶The proposed amendment also states that an additional 10% below market units will be provided,
[05:33:36] ▶roughly 68 additional units from the previously approved rezoning.
[05:33:40] ▶Can we not expect some of the used below market rentals to be rented out by young families?
[05:33:46] ▶And if so, this will create an even greater demand for local child care.
[05:33:50] ▶We need more than the developer's intention to provide child care. We need the commitment.
[05:33:55] ▶Remember that this is the same developer that had good intentions for 1045
[05:33:59] ▶Harrow Street.
[05:34:00] ▶Please consider the community and the families that will be affected when making your decisions this evening. Thank you.
[05:34:07] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you very much. Are there any other
[05:34:10] ▶callers on the line?
[05:34:16] ▶Speaker 5: There are not.
[05:34:18] ▶Speaker 33: This will be our final call then for speakers. If you wish to speak to counsel on this item, please call toll free +1 (833)
[05:34:24] ▶353-8610
[05:34:27] ▶followed by participant code 1061445Pound.
[05:34:32] ▶Phone number will be posted on x and display during the recess. We will now take a two minute recess, see if there's any additional speakers here in chambers or on the line.
[05:34:40] ▶So council will be back at 11:36,
[05:34:42] ▶please.
[05:37:44] ▶There we go. K.
[05:37:46] ▶Okay.
[05:37:47] ▶Checking in. Are there any further speakers in chambers or in the lobby?
[05:37:52] ▶Seeing or anyone?
[05:37:55] ▶Do we have any speakers on the line?
[05:37:58] ▶We do not. We do not. Okay. Thank you. In that case, I will close the speaker's list to this item. Has there been a large volume of, public comments received since 5PM?
[05:38:07] ▶Speaker 5: There has not been.
[05:38:09] ▶Speaker 33: K. In that case,
[05:38:11] ▶I will close receipt of public comments.
[05:38:15] ▶Does the applicant have any closing comments on the matter?
[05:38:19] ▶Speaker 5: Just wanted to say thank you for the consideration.
[05:38:22] ▶With every project, we engage the community. We work with with staff.
[05:38:27] ▶And we try to shape a proposal that meets the needs,
[05:38:30] ▶Speaker 56: of all parties. And this is one of the applications where we struggled so hard to try to move this project forward.
[05:38:35] ▶And, really, the only way for us to move the project forward right now is through CMHC financing.
[05:38:40] ▶Speaker 5: And so without the amendment approved, there is no project. There is no rental housing. There is no family housing. There is no childcare, albeit private.
[05:38:48] ▶Really, appreciate your support and looking forward to, continuing to work together. K. Thank you.
[05:38:55] ▶Speaker 33: Does staff have any closing comments?
[05:38:59] ▶Speaker 12: Yes. Staff would like to make a comment,
[05:39:02] ▶in response to a concern raised by one of the speakers regarding the notification process and the
[05:39:08] ▶the public consultation process.
[05:39:10] ▶For this text amendment, we follow the standard notification process. And as the the speaker pointed out,
[05:39:17] ▶it was first submitted as, it was first posted as submitted by the applicant and presented as a conversion to private ownership.
[05:39:24] ▶But after staff review and it was clear that this would be a general commercial space that was corrected in the in the material and and communicated to public as as expediently as we could.
[05:39:37] ▶For text amendments of this this type, we typically don't have public in person,
[05:39:43] ▶information sessions, and we didn't have that for this this, amendment either.
[05:39:49] ▶That's all comments for staff. Thank you. Okay. Thank you for those clarifications.
[05:39:54] ▶Speaker 33: Council,
[05:39:55] ▶any further questions to staff?
[05:39:58] ▶Only staff at this time.
[05:40:00] ▶And, indeed, there are. Counselor Orr, go ahead. Yeah. Just one quick one on,
[05:40:06] ▶Speaker 8: a comment around,
[05:40:08] ▶sort of creating a precedent. Could you just sort of talk on that around if we do this, this would sort of lead to kind of a mass exodus of
[05:40:17] ▶of childcare and conversions to to BMR?
[05:40:23] ▶Speaker 17: Sure. One thing I will say is that
[05:40:26] ▶the discretionary nature of our,
[05:40:28] ▶planning and approvals means that
[05:40:30] ▶I I would suggest that the word precedent is misplaced. It's not case law. We we make a decisions, and the council has purview to make decisions on a case by case basis.
[05:40:40] ▶In the case of negotiated
[05:40:43] ▶CACs or public benefits,
[05:40:45] ▶it's very much about the specific context of an application. Some of that can include factors such as available financing, development viability,
[05:40:54] ▶location,
[05:40:55] ▶economic conditions at the time.
[05:40:58] ▶What we try and do in the public interest is to
[05:41:01] ▶optimize and maximize
[05:41:02] ▶what's possible.
[05:41:04] ▶Those types of conversations and economics of development are very much in the realm of the art of the possible,
[05:41:10] ▶and we bring forward our best professional recommendation based
[05:41:14] ▶on economic,
[05:41:17] ▶pro form a analysis that the that the the,
[05:41:21] ▶CAC processes
[05:41:23] ▶analyze,
[05:41:25] ▶and and we bring our best professional recommendation to you based on that analysis. And
[05:41:30] ▶and council has, its purview to make the decision based on that information and the public input.
[05:41:36] ▶Speaker 8: Okay. Thanks. I appreciate that.
[05:41:38] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you for those questions.
[05:41:40] ▶Speaker 0: Councilor Zhou, go ahead. Thanks, sir. So I think staff touched about the procedure question, but I just wanna follow-up. I think one of the speaker was seeing that,
[05:41:48] ▶the referral report was on, January 20,
[05:41:52] ▶and, there's update after the referral report of January 23.
[05:41:57] ▶Can you confirm if that's the right or
[05:42:03] ▶if there's any procedure issues
[05:42:06] ▶updated after the, referral report?
[05:42:13] ▶Speaker 33: Just a moment. Yeah. Sure.
[05:42:30] ▶Speaker 12: Sorry. Right at this point, we're not aware of the change of the dates.
[05:42:36] ▶Speaker 0: Yes. So after the referral report, there's no change?
[05:42:41] ▶Speaker 12: After the the report was finalized, there was no change. Correct.
[05:42:44] ▶Speaker 0: Okay. Okay. Thanks. That's all my question. Thank you.
[05:42:48] ▶Speaker 33: Councilor Maloney.
[05:42:50] ▶Speaker 46: Thanks. And I apologize
[05:42:52] ▶if I'm
[05:42:53] ▶asking a question again. I'm very tired.
[05:42:57] ▶Can you please just go through
[05:43:00] ▶why,
[05:43:03] ▶CMHC
[05:43:04] ▶funding precludes
[05:43:06] ▶the original
[05:43:08] ▶configuration of the childcare
[05:43:11] ▶because I'm, you know, obviously extremely concerned about
[05:43:16] ▶the provision of childcare in the city, and I think the public speakers have raised some very,
[05:43:21] ▶good points.
[05:43:31] ▶Speaker 14: Ebony,
[05:43:32] ▶social,
[05:43:33] ▶senior planner for housing.
[05:43:36] ▶The the financing is predicated on
[05:43:39] ▶on
[05:43:40] ▶the, provision of 20% of the units being,
[05:43:43] ▶affordable.
[05:43:45] ▶And that
[05:43:46] ▶that, I think, just changes the
[05:43:49] ▶the the math on on the financing for the project as a whole.
[05:43:53] ▶Speaker 46: And is CMHC
[05:43:55] ▶not open
[05:43:58] ▶to any flexibility
[05:43:59] ▶in with regard to community benefits
[05:44:03] ▶such as those provided by
[05:44:06] ▶affordable child care?
[05:44:09] ▶Speaker 14: I'm not I'm not aware if
[05:44:12] ▶we reached out to CMHC about this,
[05:44:16] ▶under if my child care colleague
[05:44:19] ▶Speaker 33: would know more. Gonna come to the mic he's coming to the mic there. Yeah. Maybe I'll just
[05:44:23] ▶Speaker 17: try and help out. I think,
[05:44:25] ▶without speaking for CMHC
[05:44:27] ▶or applicants engaged with CMHC, certainly,
[05:44:31] ▶one thing we've heard is the
[05:44:33] ▶criteria and established for the various available programs
[05:44:37] ▶for financing rental development.
[05:44:39] ▶Those criteria have become they've evolved and changed in in many ways become,
[05:44:45] ▶tighter on certain criteria they're seeking.
[05:44:48] ▶And so I would say the direction has been,
[05:44:51] ▶less flexibility, not more
[05:44:54] ▶recently with, at least based on our understanding and experience with what's the way c CMHC is designing its lending programs.
[05:45:01] ▶Speaker 46: Is do you think that's just from efficiency of
[05:45:06] ▶organizational
[05:45:07] ▶efficiency in terms of getting through
[05:45:10] ▶the workload? Or
[05:45:13] ▶I mean, I'm asking you to speculate. But
[05:45:16] ▶Speaker 17: Yeah. I I can't speak for the reasoning behind what CMHC is is shifting criterion and or establishing for their financing programs. I can only,
[05:45:26] ▶sort of highlight for you what we've observed, like, has been the result of those changes.
[05:45:32] ▶Speaker 46: Josh, I'm just gonna ask another general follow-up. Yeah. I know we're all very tired. I'm sorry about this. But,
[05:45:39] ▶with the,
[05:45:42] ▶incentives we've put in place to try and get more childcare
[05:45:46] ▶I mean, more housing built,
[05:45:50] ▶What effect is that having on our provision of of childcare?
[05:45:55] ▶I mean,
[05:45:58] ▶when we're reducing
[05:46:00] ▶the amount of amenity,
[05:46:02] ▶charges being put into childcare. What's this doing to our us reaching our target of childcare in the city? Yeah. One thing I will say is that we do and maybe,
[05:46:12] ▶Speaker 17: ACCS
[05:46:13] ▶would wanna speak to this, but we certainly do have a fairly healthy,
[05:46:18] ▶pipeline of of projects that include in kind child care. I think this the number is something like 1,400,
[05:46:26] ▶or so,
[05:46:27] ▶in kind child secured public in kind child care spaces that are part of projects in in the pipeline.
[05:46:35] ▶But as you
[05:46:37] ▶highlight,
[05:46:38] ▶like, we we we can't we're not in a situation right now where every project's able to deliver every type of public public benefit.
[05:46:47] ▶We're choosing,
[05:46:48] ▶in many ways, whether we're prioritizing
[05:46:51] ▶a housing outcome, whether it's below market rental
[05:46:54] ▶versus DCL payments which pay for a broad array of infrastructure
[05:46:59] ▶or other in kind amenities
[05:47:01] ▶such as childcare or cultural space. It's there's a very, very few types of sites and projects that can support all those simultaneously.
[05:47:09] ▶That's the economic reality we're in. Not every project can solve every problem
[05:47:15] ▶that we have, and we try and seek,
[05:47:17] ▶those in kind of amenities based on the suitability of the site, what's possible based on the economics, and there's always always trade offs between those outcomes.
[05:47:27] ▶Speaker 46: Yep. And,
[05:47:29] ▶so you think that this,
[05:47:32] ▶without the CMHC funding, this this is just not gonna go ahead anytime soon, if at all?
[05:47:40] ▶Speaker 17: I I think that's what the, applicant expressed to to council tonight that that that financing is is,
[05:47:47] ▶crucial
[05:47:48] ▶to, the delivery of this project.
[05:47:51] ▶Speaker 46: Okay. Thank you.
[05:47:53] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you, councilor Maloney.
[05:47:57] ▶Clerks, have we received any further,
[05:47:59] ▶public comments since the poster
[05:48:02] ▶comments?
[05:48:03] ▶Speaker 46: Checking, sir. Thank you. We have not.
[05:48:07] ▶Speaker 33: K. Thank you for that.
[05:48:09] ▶Can I get someone to move the recommendation?
[05:48:12] ▶Move. Councilor Kirby Young, seconded by councilor Zhou.
[05:48:15] ▶And, we're moving into debate and decision. Please place yourself in the queue if you would like to debate this item.
[05:48:21] ▶And I'll advance, councilor Kirby Young. Go ahead. Yeah. Thanks.
[05:48:26] ▶Speaker 9: I I I know it's late, but I'm just feel compelled just to provide some brief comments on this one.
[05:48:31] ▶It's, it's an interesting trade off. We do know that a lot of projects,
[05:48:35] ▶are challenged economically and are not necessarily moving forward, which is why council,
[05:48:41] ▶supported some staff recommendations with respects to,
[05:48:44] ▶trying to put measures in place that would enhance development viability and ensure that we continue to to deliver more homes. We're starting to see some of those applications coming forward,
[05:48:54] ▶and we, are going through a process, I think, of explaining some of the impact of some of those changes that are resulting in yellow memos to the public. This particular one is interesting to me.
[05:49:04] ▶I would expect that in most projects like this, when,
[05:49:08] ▶something is proposed as a 10% BMR because I think a lot of the public have become used to the 20% below market rental that we would hear that is not affordable enough.
[05:49:16] ▶And so people want us to deliver more housing. They want us to deliver the tenure that,
[05:49:21] ▶is attainable for people, which is rental.
[05:49:24] ▶And,
[05:49:25] ▶they do want the below market. So it is an interesting,
[05:49:29] ▶trade off, and this is all about calibration, I think, and balance.
[05:49:33] ▶We could council has, as with any application, can, support it, amend it, or reject it. Effectively, in my mind, if it's amended or if it's rejected.
[05:49:44] ▶On this basis, it will not result in delivering the almost 700
[05:49:48] ▶rental homes.
[05:49:50] ▶And as we heard earlier, I think the applicant did say ended, but it's true. Entitlements doesn't necessarily mean delivery. I think our director of planning articulated very well that not every project can deliver every form of public benefit. In a utopic world, that would be great, where you could get below market and childcare and, you know, public space and all of those things. But we're unfortunately not in that situation.
[05:50:11] ▶Every time I see it, it gives me pause not on the specific application, but when the city,
[05:50:16] ▶has been doing so much heavy lifting to deliver on
[05:50:20] ▶housing affordability and childcare, which have predominantly
[05:50:24] ▶and historically been the previous senior governments to the point that we have neglected our own house, and we have crumbling
[05:50:29] ▶city amenities and infrastructure. So
[05:50:32] ▶does it hurt me a little bit that, the city is taking a 9,300,000
[05:50:36] ▶reduction in DCLs?
[05:50:38] ▶Yes. It does because I would love to see us, shoring up our parks, community centers, and other things, but I'm also aware that that $9,300,000
[05:50:45] ▶is hypothetical
[05:50:46] ▶if a building doesn't actually get built. It's just DCLs on paper.
[05:50:50] ▶And, so all of that in balance is that financing is difficult to achieve. It does require significant amount of equity, particularly on large scale projects like this. And I do think it was noteworthy. I think it was mentioned earlier that this is the only project in BC
[05:51:04] ▶to receive,
[05:51:05] ▶funding through CMHC's apartment construction loan financing program.
[05:51:09] ▶That is
[05:51:11] ▶a big statement.
[05:51:13] ▶And considering the need that we have as and we have we are one of the most expensive housing markets in the country.
[05:51:19] ▶That is disturbing.
[05:51:21] ▶So,
[05:51:22] ▶it's this is about trade offs and weighing it. That is the job that we have to do,
[05:51:28] ▶in front of us, and that doesn't always mean that those decisions are perfect.
[05:51:33] ▶But having 700 new homes is better than a building not proceeding.
[05:51:37] ▶Having an intention, which I hope is genuine, and we did hear the applicant speak to that on the record, to try to lease that space to a childcare operator makes sense. It sounds like it's been provisioned that,
[05:51:48] ▶a normal commercial operator that or a retail type probably would want it because you don't have the street front frontage, and so it was referenced that it has,
[05:51:56] ▶it has sort of outdoor space and access. So,
[05:51:59] ▶keeping sort of, you know, prospecting sort of, statements that were made around that one. But I think on balance, it is the greater good to move this project forward. But this, I think, really does outline a project or two major issues that we have in the city. One, which is ensuring that we don't end up with,
[05:52:16] ▶a lot of sort of a dearth of projects being built. And if we start to see a decrease in supply, we will not continue to see some of the declines in rent and the increases in avail in vacancy rate that we have seen,
[05:52:29] ▶which we need.
[05:52:30] ▶And we will continue to financially be stuck at the city in terms of trying to deliver community amenities, which do come in many forms. So on balance in in weighing all of it, I will support the application. Thank you.
[05:52:43] ▶Speaker 33: Thanks,
[05:52:44] ▶councilor Kirbiong.
[05:52:46] ▶I'm just gonna add a a couple of comments.
[05:52:50] ▶Oh, yes. I'll really push to chair to you, mister.
[05:52:55] ▶Thanks.
[05:52:55] ▶I I just I I think,
[05:52:57] ▶really appreciating,
[05:52:59] ▶the dialogue this evening, and I'm recognizing it is late.
[05:53:02] ▶And hearing from the different speakers, some of you are still here,
[05:53:06] ▶around what has been, I think, well articulated by, Councilor Kirbati Young, but also by our staff around,
[05:53:12] ▶that sometimes in this decision making, it really is about trade offs. And I I thought our general manager,
[05:53:18] ▶really,
[05:53:19] ▶was bang on in in articulating that not every project can solve every problem,
[05:53:24] ▶because that was going through my mind as I was seeing,
[05:53:28] ▶this application come back having,
[05:53:30] ▶been on council when we've initially approved it.
[05:53:34] ▶And, I think that,
[05:53:36] ▶what I what I find interesting, particularly, is listening to Councilor Maloney's questions around the CMHC
[05:53:41] ▶financing,
[05:53:43] ▶a piece. And I think we need to look at things in context right now. There's a market context,
[05:53:50] ▶which may be beyond our control. There's some things we've initiated at council to try to,
[05:53:55] ▶better enable a whole continuum of housing in the city. But in in the global context and federal context,
[05:54:02] ▶the federal government wants to deliver on housing right now. That is one of the number one things that so there's other other major projects across the country they're looking at, but one is definitely housing. And so I think when we look at CMHC financing,
[05:54:14] ▶and the question as to whether why is it, you know, are they not considering childcare in this? They have a very clear mandate on housing, and the new prime minister and federal government has articulated that. And I I think the other piece I would I would say is,
[05:54:28] ▶we are increasingly,
[05:54:30] ▶seeing projects come forward. They're being rezoned or properties and sites, and and and nothing is being delivered in this market. And this is a stone's throw away from the spy train station,
[05:54:39] ▶literally, stone's throw away. And it is an opportunity to deliver,
[05:54:43] ▶both market rental and below market rental,
[05:54:46] ▶right adjacent to,
[05:54:48] ▶rapid transit,
[05:54:49] ▶in an area that is is,
[05:54:51] ▶shifting and developing and growing and and I think in a positive way. I was just there a couple weeks ago. So,
[05:54:58] ▶I am also of of the mind,
[05:55:00] ▶to support the text amendment at this time. I think that,
[05:55:04] ▶there may be some innovative opportunities that can be undertaken with the commercial space with,
[05:55:09] ▶childcare operators.
[05:55:11] ▶I'll I'll leave that to the applicant to sort out because I I did appreciate the clarity, clarification,
[05:55:16] ▶that indeed the space is is really being designed,
[05:55:20] ▶for the purpose and use of of a childcare operator in the future. So that is not lost here,
[05:55:25] ▶and that that will be maintained as well.
[05:55:28] ▶So on balance, I'm prepared to support the application. I'll now move to, councilor Orr and then councilor Maloney
[05:55:33] ▶for final comments.
[05:55:35] ▶Speaker 1: Go ahead, councilor Orr. Can you this is councilor Claussen. Can you put me on the queue, please? Thank you. Yes. We can. Thank you for flagging that. Go ahead, councilor Orr.
[05:55:45] ▶Speaker 8: Thanks. Yeah. I appreciate the discussion.
[05:55:48] ▶I definitely think there's room to look more closely at,
[05:55:52] ▶policy around converting in child,
[05:55:55] ▶child care to commercial zoning and around, security of tenure.
[05:56:00] ▶And I will note that Council did just make it easier for developers to build child care.
[05:56:06] ▶But I think saying no to this would mean saying
[05:56:10] ▶no to both rental housing and private childcare.
[05:56:15] ▶I wasn't on council when this was approved, so it's difficult to hear that if you feel like it was a bait and switch.
[05:56:23] ▶I appreciate the staff response on,
[05:56:25] ▶on the precedence question and and the perceived error,
[05:56:30] ▶and and the the discussion around CMHC financing and and the talk of trade offs was really valuable for me.
[05:56:38] ▶And I understand from the from the speaker, you know, that,
[05:56:41] ▶there's
[05:56:43] ▶not the same value in exchange of BMR and childcare. They're just not equal, and I get that
[05:56:49] ▶too.
[05:56:50] ▶And as we saw today, you know, 20% BMR is gonna become more rare,
[05:56:56] ▶with this rental,
[05:56:57] ▶relief program.
[05:56:59] ▶We changed it to 20% average.
[05:57:03] ▶So I feel kind of like I'm in an impossible position here to to,
[05:57:07] ▶either to vote for affordable rentals or or city owned childcare. I think it's a really tough one. I think it also really underscores,
[05:57:14] ▶the importance of public hearings. Kinda underscores also the the just the interesting sort of,
[05:57:20] ▶place that we find ourselves recently in terms of,
[05:57:25] ▶you know, just dealing with this difficult market and and and the things that people have to do,
[05:57:30] ▶to get stuff built. But so I think in lieu of a policy,
[05:57:34] ▶specific policy on this, I think I'll abstain. Thanks.
[05:57:40] ▶Speaker 33: Sorry.
[05:57:41] ▶I think councilor Maloney was ahead of councilor Clausen, or did you move yourself, councilor Maloney?
[05:57:46] ▶You're good to
[05:57:48] ▶you're
[05:57:49] ▶okay. Just checking. Okay. Go ahead, councilor Clausen.
[05:57:54] ▶Speaker 1: Thanks very much.
[05:57:56] ▶So,
[05:57:58] ▶it has been a long night and a long day, but I wanted just to provide just a few quick comments here.
[05:58:04] ▶Particularly, is hearing in on the on the childcare
[05:58:07] ▶as I think,
[05:58:09] ▶some of my colleagues on on on council have already addressed,
[05:58:13] ▶some of the more remarkable aspects, including that CMHC
[05:58:17] ▶funding. It clearly
[05:58:19] ▶took a lot of, inertia and and,
[05:58:22] ▶and dedication to try to see this building get built. And, there was some creativity,
[05:58:27] ▶in involved in that, which I think deserves to be acknowledged.
[05:58:31] ▶But, just to understand,
[05:58:34] ▶there's been a significant amount of work that has taken place.
[05:58:37] ▶I know the councilor, Dominato and myself have
[05:58:41] ▶zeroed in a lot on the childcare file during this term.
[05:58:44] ▶The most recent,
[05:58:46] ▶report that came back,
[05:58:48] ▶that was,
[05:58:49] ▶approved by council that,
[05:58:52] ▶allowed for,
[05:58:53] ▶additional,
[05:58:57] ▶ways for us to, have a more relaxation,
[05:59:01] ▶to allow home based childcare.
[05:59:03] ▶Having,
[05:59:04] ▶it's it's been a long time since,
[05:59:06] ▶my daughter was in in childcare.
[05:59:08] ▶She's in her twenties now.
[05:59:10] ▶So I I don't wanna try and say that I can relate to to parents that are struggling today. But, boy, all the people I have spoken to, on this,
[05:59:19] ▶in in this, area
[05:59:21] ▶have been desperate for spaces. And and too often, they're having to drive,
[05:59:27] ▶over bridges
[05:59:28] ▶and into other municipalities
[05:59:30] ▶to try and find spaces
[05:59:31] ▶just so they can keep working.
[05:59:33] ▶Having access to childcare,
[05:59:36] ▶regardless of the,
[05:59:38] ▶the operator
[05:59:39] ▶is an absolute need. And,
[05:59:43] ▶when we say that we have a turnkey space,
[05:59:46] ▶that, just means that the city would essentially be able to decide who was going to be the operator. And as we heard today from the provincial budget,
[05:59:56] ▶the ten a day funding is is on hold indefinitely.
[06:00:00] ▶So that means that, it's gonna be harder and harder for that,
[06:00:05] ▶public publicly funded childcare
[06:00:07] ▶is gonna be,
[06:00:09] ▶really hard to get. And so in in lieu of that, we're seeing some excellent private operators that are coming forward and providing absolutely class a,
[06:00:19] ▶childcare.
[06:00:19] ▶And so I just wanna, kind of, for that standpoint, try to,
[06:00:25] ▶signal very strongly, both to the applicant,
[06:00:28] ▶but also the community members that came out to speak today that I think,
[06:00:33] ▶notwithstanding some of the fears that were expressed, I think we are going to see, from the space that was essentially
[06:00:40] ▶is being built, that is designed for childcare
[06:00:43] ▶will have
[06:00:44] ▶a childcare operator in there. And that's something that I know that we'll be watching closely as this project proceeds. But
[06:00:52] ▶I think,
[06:00:53] ▶do not lose hope because I do think,
[06:00:56] ▶there, there are some really great childcare operators,
[06:00:59] ▶both public and private and not for profit,
[06:01:01] ▶that are all out there.
[06:01:03] ▶And, and we are seeing
[06:01:05] ▶really great operators coming forward. And it's in part due to the great work our city staff have done,
[06:01:13] ▶with some direction from council to try and, again,
[06:01:17] ▶think,
[06:01:18] ▶more outside the box and how we can try and create more spaces. So anyway,
[06:01:23] ▶I'm I'm intending to to support, this tax amendment,
[06:01:26] ▶but I just wanna, add those reflections on the childcare piece. Thanks very much. Thank you, councilor Claussen.
[06:01:32] ▶Speaker 33: Councilor Maloney.
[06:01:34] ▶Speaker 46: Yeah. This is a tough one.
[06:01:37] ▶Without CMHC
[06:01:39] ▶funding, this project doesn't go ahead, and CMHC
[06:01:43] ▶isn't funding without 20% below market,
[06:01:46] ▶and we need housing.
[06:01:48] ▶And we can't have both the childcare
[06:01:50] ▶as envisioned
[06:01:52] ▶and the below market and have it built.
[06:01:56] ▶But I'm I'm very concerned
[06:01:58] ▶about,
[06:01:59] ▶childcare facilities going by the wayside
[06:02:05] ▶and the effect that that's gonna have on parents not having
[06:02:10] ▶as many childcare places in the pipeline. Because I know we well, we've heard that we've got lots of childcare in the pipeline, but
[06:02:18] ▶compared to the need, it's nowhere near enough.
[06:02:23] ▶So I know that this still provides the space for childcare, but, obviously, it would be better if it was city owned affordable
[06:02:30] ▶childcare.
[06:02:35] ▶And I feel like
[06:02:36] ▶as lovely as it is, the home based child care that we passed
[06:02:42] ▶just isn't gonna make a dent in delivering the child care that we need. And and as I said, it's gonna be parents that suffer, but I would rather this go ahead than not.
[06:02:53] ▶It's just that's
[06:02:54] ▶a real shame all around.
[06:02:57] ▶So
[06:02:58] ▶I'm trying to decide between
[06:03:01] ▶abstaining and voting yes, and,
[06:03:04] ▶so I have about
[06:03:05] ▶probably ten seconds to make that decision.
[06:03:08] ▶Speaker 33: Thank you. You too indeed, councilor Maloney. I'll try to speak slowly.
[06:03:12] ▶Thank you.
[06:03:15] ▶I do not see any other councilors on the queue. I'm just gonna clear it now. And so with that, I am gonna call the vote. And just a reminder to counselors online,
[06:03:24] ▶please have your video enabled. Please be visible,
[06:03:28] ▶and please vote online.
[06:03:32] ▶And, clerks, I will take a vote assist in favor, please.
[06:03:36] ▶Speaker 1: Chair, councilor Klassen, can I get a vote assist in favor, please? Yes. Indeed. We'll do that.
[06:03:52] ▶Speaker 33: Okay. Thank you, counsel.
[06:03:54] ▶So this item passes,
[06:03:56] ▶with myself, councilor Kirby Young, Fraser Frey, Montague, Classen, Meisner, Joe,
[06:04:02] ▶Maloney in favor, and councilor Ohr abstaining.
[06:04:06] ▶And that concludes this item.
[06:04:08] ▶Just a reminder that,
[06:04:10] ▶item four on our agenda has been referred to the March 4.
[06:04:16] ▶Oh, there we go. Thank you.
[06:04:19] ▶The meeting is recessed until Wednesday, 03/04/2026
[06:04:22] ▶at 3PM here in Council Chambers and electronically to continue with item four that I was referring to.
[06:04:28] ▶So thank you very much to council, clerks,
[06:04:31] ▶staff,
[06:04:32] ▶applicants.
[06:04:32] ▶Oh, I have to oh, and I have to read one more thing. Sorry, folks. Don't leave.
[06:04:36] ▶I will remind council that it is very important to not engage in any discussion or correspondence,
[06:04:41] ▶with respects to the remaining application, which is item four on our agenda.
[06:04:45] ▶Thank you. Have a good evening. Drive safe. Walk safe. Ride safe. You're riding.
[06:04:51] ▶Yeah.